Panel 5
A summary of topics discussed in this news group since inception.
Most have opinions pro and con, we do not attempt to summarize these here.
Topics: (many topics discussed in other groups instead e.g., r.b.p.)
See Special section on panel 12 (netiquette) about pyramid scheme
(Dave Rhodes) and Craig Shergold post card posts.
Guns
Hunting (rec.hunting [moderated] better)
Control
Domestic animals: dogs, horses (rec.equestrian better), cows, sheep,
'Ecology' and environment (some talk.environment better)
Wild animals
'Lethal' wildlife, bears, etc. (Also see guns, environment)
general questions about wildlife, snakes,
Plants botany
Spring flowers
(forests big in ca|sci|talk.environment)
Equipment, munge, gear, junk, rangoon, stuff
(largely seekable in books or vendor literature, at stores, mail order)
Stoves (MSR [XKG vs. Whisperlite] vs. Peak 1 vs. alcohol vs....)
Water filters Gortex
Tents Sleeping bags (cleaning)
Packs Bivy sacks
Altimeters Flares
Radios/phones/GPS Special accounts
REI the company (#s) repairs
Radioactivity of some latern mantles
Food
Recipes Dehydration
Memorable meals
MREs (try a surplus store, in the Yellow Pages[tm])
[Yes, yes, we know, Meal Rejected by Ethiopians]
Climbing (rec.climbing better)
Protection ethics
style chalk
Testing, physics, etc. Ratings, names of climbs,
'Lycra and wool'
alt.lycra
Sport climbing (rec.climbing better)
climbing walls
Skills
To build a fire, Quest for fire
Maps
General survival, military survival
Locations
Where?
Limited trip reports
Conditions
Environmental issues
Giardia/Lyme Disease/Poison Oak Land Ethics
Man's place in Mountain bikes
4WD Technology
Weather (day, night, lightning) Natl. Parks/Forests
Definitions of wilderness/mountains/etc.History
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/16/1133.html
Altitude and altitude sickness
What goes on/ happens/ to do in evenings
No, giardia, mosquitos, poison oak, do not confur immunity in small
doses/exposures.
Firearms. You may carry firearms for protection. Be familiar with
the weapon and its potential. Shooting, other than for protection
is prohibited in the Park.
...
Subsistence Use
Local native and non-native residents use park and preserve resources
to support their subsistence way of life. ...
--Gates of the Arctic National Park
"In general terms, you may not carry a firearm within
the boundaries of Denali National Park. If you
possess a firearm it cannot be carried on your person
or in a backpack, etc. All firearms must be stored
unloaded, broken down and placed out of sight, such
as in the trunk of your vehicle. If contacted by a
park ranger you must immediately declare that you
have a firearm. Firearms are NOT needed for
protection from bears! Secure storage for firearms
MAY be available while you are in the park. Contact
any park ranger for details or if you have questions
concerning firearms.
For questions regarding the use of firearms in
Preserve lands and new park additions please contact
a park ranger.
Generally these lands are open to sport and/or
subsistence hunting."
http://www.nps.gov/dena/frequently-asked-questions-regarding-bears.htm
Music, singing, sound, reading ('off-hour' entertainment), riddles
Rescue
Equipment of
Stories, epics, accidents
First Aid -- Tourniquets
Employment (life style misc.rural)
Computer and non-computer related
Volunteer work (trail building/hut maintenance)
Ski mountaineering and other winter activities (rec.skiing better)
avalanches
General mountain trivia
Cavers are better than climbers
Reading
St. Edward Abbey
McPhee
Films
Others
Boats (rec.boats.paddle better)
Caving (caving mailing list, see panel 26 and panel 1)
Minorities (Black, Asian, Native American)
Women (fewer) and the outdoors
Sex in the outdoors
Beginners: at anything (Tenderfeet)
Children
Learning: NOLS, OB
Waviers, disclaimers, liability
Is Alaska like Northern Exposure? (NO)
If topics do not appear, it may be that they have moved to other newsgroups.
Photography: taking pictures (personal or commercial [e.g., Ansel Adams,
Galen Rowell, Eliott Porter, et al.]), equipment, reporting, etc.
From Pebble Beach:
No depiction by photography, artist rendering or any other means of
any property owned by Pebble Beach Company may be used for commercial
purposes or published without the prior written consent of the
Company. Requests should be directed the the Company's Director of
Public Relations.
Other signs:
From Area 51:
** is emphasis for red rather than black lettering
*WARNING* (in red large print)
--------------------------------------------------
Restricted Area
It is unlawful to enter this area without
permission from the Installation Commander.
Sec. 21, Internal Security Act of 1950; U.S.C. 797
Whle on this Installation all personnel and
the property under their control are subject
to search.
*in red: Use of deadly force authorized. *
small print:
Supercedes AF Form 2527 Nov. 81
Distribution
AFVA 207-1
10 October 1986
From Monument Valley:
TBD
ATTENTION ITINERAIRE DE MONTAGNE NON BALISE
AVIS AUX SKIEURS
ATTENTION! au del de cella limite vous sortez du domaine skiable balise
du Brevent. Devant vous commence un itineraire de montagne non balise,
celci-ci conformement a l'arrete municipal du 12-1-1983 ne compred pas
de service d'ouverture ni de fermeture. De plus il est tres "avalancheux".
Si vous l'empruntez, c'est a vas riske et perils, sous votre propre
responsibilite.
WARNING! after this point you leave the marked piste of Brevent.
In front of you is an off piste mountain track. States that the
ski patrol does not open or close this track. It is very avalanche prone.
If you decide to ski this track, you do so at your own risque and peril
and your own responsibility.
ACHTUNG! hier verlassen Sie das gesicherte Skigebiet. Alpine Gefahren.
Der Bedarf fur dieses Symbol wurde bei der Sitzung von Schrocksandel und
Scheiber angegeben.
..
OU CELLE DE LA COMMUNE
PUISSE ETRE RECHERCHEE.
WARNING FOR VISITORS
BEWARE!
BEYOND THIS POINT YOU ARE
ON A HIGH ALPIN TRACK.
YOU DO SO ON YOUR OWN
RESPONSIBILITY. IN NO WAY
CAN THE "CABLE CAR'S" OR
CITY'S LIABILITY BE INVOLVED.
SCHILAUFER AND BERGSTEIGER
ACHTUNG!
AB HIER BEGENEN SIE SICH AUF
EINE HOCHGEBIRGSWIG. SIE
UNTERNEHMEN ALLES AUF EIGENE
GEFAHR. DIE VERANTWORTUNG
DER GEMEINDE ODER DER
SEILBAHN WIRD AUF KEINEN
FALL IN ANSPRUCH GENOMMEN.
chamonix
CAMPING EN ALTITUDE INTERDIT,
SEUL BIVOUAC AUTORISE DU COUCHER AU LEVER DU SOLEIL,
ARRETE MUNICIPAL No 102.92 DU 30 JUN 1992
CAMPEGGIO IN ALTITUDINE PROHIBITO,
SOLTANTO BIVACCO AUTORIZZATO DAL TRAMANTO ALL ALBA,
DECRETO MUNICIPALE No 102.92 DEL 30/06/1992
FORBIDDEN TO CAMP IN THE MOUNTAINS,
PERMISSION ONLY FOR BIVOUAC FROM SUNSET TO SUNRISE,
ORDER BY LAW ...
General "News" from other media
Sensation, records, happening, events
The different groups reading r.b tend to fall thusly:
Beginners (novices) and infrequents tend to ask obvious material
(hardware) and concrete questions: equipment to buy, fads & fashion, etc.
Most likely to faux pas. Possibly follows Boehm/Brooks curves about
hardware and software.
Intermediates: More experience and concern with where to go,
technique, practice, less concrete ideas, less tangible tastes (developing).
Starting to understand limits.
More advanced: questions ethics, styles, philosophy, least tangible of all.
Opinions change and flucutate. Shortest description.
On anon posts:
Anon.penet.fi is an anonymous remailer. If you don't like the posts
coming from there, writing "ab...@anon.penet.fi" and complain.
=====
He went away from the basement of Building 14 that day,
and left this note in his cubicle, on top of his computer terminal:
"I'm going to a commune in Vermont and will deal
with no unit of time shorter than a season."
--The Soul of a New Machine by Tracy Kidder, 1981
=====
'Understand the procedure, now?
Just stop a few of their machines and radios and telephones and lawnmowers.
Throw them into darkness for a few hours, and then, sit back and watch
the pattern.'
"And this pattern is always the same?"
'With few variations.
They pick the most dangerous enemy they can find, and it's themselves.
All we need do is sit back and watch.'
"And I take it this place, Maple Street, is not unique."
'By no means, their world is full of Maple streets.
And we will go from one to the other and let them destroy themselves.
One to the other.
One to the other.
One to the other.'
Serling:
The tools of conquest do not necessarily come with bombs and explosions
and fallout. There are weapons that are simply thoughts, attitudes,
prejudices -- to be found in the minds of men. For the record, prejudices
can kill and suspicion can destroy, and a thoughtless, frightened search
for a scapegoat has a fallout all its own -- for the children and the
children yet unborn. And the pity of it is that these things cannot be
confined to the Twilight Zone.
TABLE OF CONTENTS of this chain:
5/ Summary of past topics <* THIS PANEL *>
6/ Non-wisdom: fire-arms topic circular discussion
7/ Phone / address lists
8/ Fletcher's Law of Inverse Appreciation / Rachel Carson / Foreman and Hayduke
9/ Water Filter wisdom
10/ Volunteer Work
11/ Snake bite
12/ Netiquette
13/ Questions on conditions and travel
14/ Dedication to Aldo Leopold
15/ Leopold's lot.
16/ Morbid backcountry/memorial
17/ Information about bears
18/ Poison ivy, frequently ask, under question
19/ Lyme disease, frequently ask, under question
20/ "Telling questions" backcountry Turing test (under construction)
21/ AMS
22/ Babies and Kids
23/ A bit of song (like camp songs)
24/ What is natural?
25/ A romantic notion of high-tech employment
26/ Other news groups of related interest, networking
27/ Films/cinema references
28/ References (written)
1/ DISCLAIMER
2/ Ethics
3/ Learning I
4/ learning II (lists, "Ten Essentials," Chouinard comments)
Gear section.
To summarize past discussions on this matter (Dave Mann).
Goretex not waterproof enough?
Is so! Is not! Is so! Is not! ... ad nauseum ...
Goretex breathable?
Is so! Is not! Is so! Is not! ... ad nauseum ...
...
Velcro: George de Mestral (from cockleburs)
PostIts(tm) (3M) [Art Fry and Spencer Silver]
Oh, boy. This is a religious issue, and I've been flamed before for even
sticking a toe in it. To be as neutral as possible:
Bringing a dog in the backcountry is illegal in many National Parks,
and is illegal unless the dog is on a leash at all times in many
wilderness areas. The Colorado Mountain Club doesn't permit dogs on its
trips, and I believe this is true for most such organizations.
Reasons:
- most dogs will harass wildlife to some degree, and even the best-behaved
dog will scare the hell out of most wild critters, a stress they don't need
on top of the problems they already have from too many people and too little
habitat.
- most (non-dog-bringing) people really don't like having other people's dogs
around while they're in the backcountry. At best, as a friend once said,
"bringing a dog is like bringing a brass band." They disturb the peace of
the backcountry, and reduce the chances of seeing any wildlife to near zero.
- In heavily used areas, the dog shit is a problem because of worries about
spreading giardia and other nasties. Not to mention what it does to the trails.
All that said, _lots_ of people do it, and usually nothing happens to them
aside from a few nasty looks. Your Milage May Vary.
Chuck Smythe
Bring the dog.
Leave the dog at home.
Dogs have the same right to be in the backcountry as people.
Dogs scare off wildlife, and cause undue stress to fragile species.
Dogs protect you against wild animals at night.
Dogs attract bears like honey, and lead the bears straight to you.
Dogs don't tear up the environment any more than people/horses.
Dogs shit in the woods, and carry diseases.
Dogs can be quiet and well behaved.
Dogs intrude upon the privacy of other backcountry users.
etc.
etc.
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 92 20:54:36 -0500
From: awes...@vela.acs.oakland.edu (Tony Wesley)
Subject: Re: Another Dog Bite/Call Cops
Greetings.
In rec.backcountry you write:
[etc...]
>I grabbed two of the dog articles and will edit them into panel 5 (previous
>topics). (Chuck and Brian's articles)
May I offer another contribution to the panel? I wrote the following and
uploaded it to CompuServe's OUTDOOR forum about 3-4 years ago.
======================================================================
Take the Dog?
Many of us like to get away for one or two weeks in the summer, and
camp in a state or national park. For those of us with dogs, this can
create a dilemma. What do we do with Fido?
There are three choices. One, you can have Fido boarded while you
are away. You can leave your pet with a friend or relative. Or thirdly,
you can take your dog with you. Which is best for you and your dog?
Boarding houses are usually well run. Many of the people in this
business are there because they like animals. But, to be on the safe
side, you should have dealt with this house before or known someone who
has. A good animal boarding house will exercise your dog. Your dog
should get attention. It should be clean and keep your dog from being
exposed to diseased animals. If you chose your place carefully, you'll
be relaxed on your vacation knowing that Fido is safe and happy on his
vacation.
Family and friends are great -- if they and your dog get along. If
you have a friend who is also a dog owner, perhaps you can work out an
arrangement to "doggy sit" for each other. But make sure that they know
your dog, that they have the time to take care of your pet. Remember
that your pet is going to be upset that you are gone. If your pet's
temporary caretaker is gone too long, your pet may develop poor toilet
habits or start chewing things.
So, why not take the dog with you? If you and your dog are ready
for it, this can be the best experience of all. My dog, Pepper, has
seen more of Michigan than most of its residents. Pepper has been on
many car camping trips, a couple canoe journeys, as well as backpacking
and several extended day hikes.
Before you take the dog, ask yourself some questions. Does your dog
bark a lot? Is it high strung? If you are camping in a fairly crowded
park, as many are on holidays, you may have neighboring campers only 20
or 30 feet away. It's their vacation too. If your dog is not
well-mannered, it is best to leave it behind.
Will you be doing things that require you to leave the dog behind?
Many people have different ideas on how to camp. Do you plan on going
into town for meals and spending the evening at the local watering hole?
Perhaps you want to take a boat cruise or a train ride. You probably
cannot take your dog there.
Make sure your dog is allowed where you're going. For instance,
dogs are not allowed in the backpacking country of Pictured Rocks
National Park. I believe this is true for the National Parks in
general. Avoid the tragedy of traveling with your pet for hundreds of
miles and finding out you can't stay where you planned.
Many dogs can stay in the car for an hour or so without incident.
If you do, be sure that the car isn't too hot. Direct sunlight can heat
the interior of car to over 120 degrees. Don't leave your dog back at
the campsite. A barking dog tied to a picnic table for hours is sure to
invite a lynching party for its owners and deservedly so. Pepper stays
in the car if we go into town, normally a rare occurrence when we camp.
We make sure the windows are partially lowered. The car is parked in
the shade if possible, a sun shield is placed in the windshield.
Is there enough room for your pet? With today's smaller cars,
taking the dog may pose yet another problem. Pepper is a large dog, a
mixed breed Bouvier/German Shepherd/Labrador/??? weighing in at eighty
pounds. She requires most of the back seat of our Escort. Toss a
cooler in the back seat with Pepper, add camping gear in the back and
the car gets pretty crowded. One of our most unforgettable moments
occurred when Pepper, crowded by my wife who was getting something out
of the cooler, crawled into the front seat. Two adults and a large dog
in the front seat of an Escort is an interesting packaging problem, to
say the least. Getting Pepper turned around and back where she belonged
rivaled the best slap-stick comedy I've ever seen.
So, before deciding to take your dog on vacation, make sure
everything can fit! You may be surprised how fast you car or truck
fills up. A practice load of your vehicle in advance is probably a good
idea if you haven't used it previously for camping.
Have you ever traveled with your dog? The beginning of a 10-hour
trip to the desolate netherlands is a bad place to find out that Fido
gets car sick.
When sleeping in a tent, you'll be in close confines with your pet.
If Fido is loaded with fleas, they'll be visiting your sleeping bag. A
good idea is to give your dog a flea bath before you go, and then give
him one when you get back. Your dog should have its shots, and be
protected against rabies and heartworm. If you're not sure, check with
your veterinarian before you go.
And let's not forget flying insects. While the dog's fur will
protect it against mosquitoes, black flies are a different story. You
can spray your dog with insect repellent as long as you keep it out of
Fido's face. The ears are a particularly vulnerable spot. To apply it
there, spray it on your hands and rub it on your dog's ears. Some
people use a bandanna to help keep the flies away.
Plan on keeping Fido under control. Other people may not enjoy your
dog as much as you do. Depending on how well trained your dog is, this
may or may not mean keeping it tied up all the time. Courtesy for your
fellow vacationers when mean a more enjoyable trip for all concerned.
And don't forget to pack the dog's food, dog dishes and a leash. And
toss in a blanket for Fido's bed. If you and your dog are ready, you'll
have a wonderful trip!
If you have comments or question, please contact me via the OUTDOOR
forum or by electronic mail. Thanks. Tony Wesley 72770,2053.
======================================================================
>This is the Usenet: do you expect anything other than gross generalizations?
Usually not. But sometimes there are a few sterling exceptions.
Speaking of contributions, if you e-mail to me a copy of the panel
about backcountry fatalities (where my e-mail is tacked on the back),
I'd like to clean that up a bit and add some other numbers. Bee
strings. Lightning strikes. I'll shoot it back your way and see if the
mods meet with your approval, O wise one.
--
Tony Wesley awes
...@vela.acs.oakland.edu
Are you thinking of telephones and managers and where you got to be at noon?
The original simpler paragraph reads (Voge):
"Ducks" made up of two or three stones stacked vertically have been
place by various person to mark routes on peaks and along
knapsack routes. These are sometimes useful, but should be viewed
with SKEPTICISM. Many ducks have little significance. Some may
led to poorer routes. The climber who encounters ducks down not
usually know what the builder of the duck had in mind, and
it is better for a climber to judge the situation for himself
than to blindly follow a series of ducks.
Sometimes a duck is built to mark the right (or the wrong) chute
for descent from a ridge. It is the feeling of the editor that
climbers who know their business will rarely need a duck to find a
return route. If a duck is built for such a purpose it is usually
best to destroy it on return. The building of ducks, except in a
few exceptional places, should probably be discouraged.
Ref: Climbers Guides to the High Sierra by the late Hervey Voge
What arrogance the duck builder has! Does he really believe that he
has found the *only* possible route? Does he believe that he has checked
out all alternate routes? Does he think we can't find our own way?
--Steve Roper, a Climbers Guide to the High Sierra, 1976
... it is better for a climber to judge the situation for himself than
to follow blidnly a series of ducks."
--Hervy Voge, a Climbers Guide to the High Sierra
What constitutes a 'mountain?'
Oh, about a 3,000 ft. rise above surrounding territory. Numerous exceptions
exist.
Article 23613 of rec.backcountry:
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: allen%asylum.cs.utah....@cs.utah.edu (Allen Sanderson)
Subject: Re: wheels in wilderness
Date: 7 Aug 92 10:16:38 MDT
To answer the question about using a one wheeled device to "carry" a
pack into wilderness areas I did a bit of reading.
The Wilderness Act:
..., There shall be no temporary road, no use of motor vehicles,
motorized equipment or motorboats, no landing of aircraft, no other
form of mechanical transport, and no structure or installation within
such area.
CFR (Code of Federal Regulations) Rev. July 1988
The following are prohibited in a National Forest Wilderness::
(a) Possessing or using a motor vehicle, motorboat or motorized
equipment ...
(b) Possessing or using a hang glider or bicycle.
The following are prohibited in a National Forest Primitive Area::
(b) Possessing or using a motor or motorized equipment, except small
battery powered hand held devices, such as cameras, shavers,
flashlights, and Geiger-counters.
Now from the Forest Service Manual Rev. 4/86
Title 2320.5 Definitions
3. Mechanical Transport. Any contrivance for moving people or
material in or over land, water, or air, having moving parts, that
provides a mechanical advantage to the user, and that is powered by
a living or nonliving power source. This includes, but is not
limited to, sailboats, hang gliders, parachutes, bicycles, game
carriers, carts, and wagons. It does not include wheelchairs when
used as necessary medical applicances.
So overall I would bow out and say one wheeled devices are illegal.
And it seems that bikes have always been illegal. But that is the
price we pay sometimes for wilderness. Buy a goat and have it carry
your pack, they are much easier to transport, manage, and are easier
on the land than llamas, or horses.
The final bit reading I did goes back cairns ;-).
From the CRFs pertaining to all National Forest Land (including wilderness).
The following are prohibited:
(a) Constructing, placing, or maintaining any kind road, trail,
structure, fence, enclosure, ... , or other improvement on
National Forest system land without a special-use authorization,
contract, or approved operating plan.
Well as I read it constructing/maintaining a cairn (which is part of a
trail) is illegal. It does say anything about removing them ;-))).
Allen R. Sanderson
Salt Lake City, Oootah
Standard stove joke follows...
A guy goes parachuting for the first time and jumps out of the plane.
The chute fails to open. He recalls his instructors words and calmly
pulls the back-up rip cord. Again, no chute. Our hero is perplexed
but still calm. He has noticed another chap below him who is flying
up to meet him. As the pass the following conversation enues.
"Say, do you know anything about parachutes?"
"Sorry, I don't. Do *you* know anything about (fill in stove brand here)?"
Long standing stove debate and criticism stands on the MSR lines of stoves.
MSR stoves were designed for winter use in the Pacific Northwest to melt
snow of water. Period. The joke goes the MSR has two settings: off and high.
This is for melting snow or boiling water. If you read the directions,
they recommend that if simmering is needed, use a can lid or similar flat
plate for indirect heating. Sure, weighs more, but it's a survival stove.
Always use the right tool for the right purpose.
Q: Should I sleep in my clothes or in the buff (in a sleeping bag)?
How should I know?
This is so dependent on your conditions, it is one of the ultimate
"your mileage may vary" questions. It depends on the quality of your
sleeping bag, your physical condition: sleepy? tired? sleep deprived?
hungry? expresso? the environmental conditions (summer, winter). Etc.
The thing to do isn't to ask here, it's to go out and do it. And find out.
And then, don't report it here so that the next guy can figure out for
themselves. Sleep one night in your back yard with your clothes on and
another night when them off.
AT == Appalachian Trail
Alcohol (and other compunds)
=======
Drinking as a problem in the outdoors. Re: skiing under the influence,
shooting under the influence, and the general topic, etc.
Interestingly, the reader/poster attempts at logical discussion on this topic
aren't very logical. They mostly center on vasodialation of veins/art.
and heat loss. This completely misses the point. The point tends to be
with loss of judgment. There isn't a question here, the problem is well
documented.
Few argue that moderation and moderate drinking in comparatively safe
circumstances isn't an issue. The problem is that safety margins are
POTENTIALLY reduced.
-------------------------------------
Worldwide alternative names for fuels
-------------------------------------
Version 11.
18th Jan 1994
Included: Turkey,
Updated: Holland, Germany, Switzerland (German speaking part),
The following list contains data for approx 30 countries. I would like
to expand the list to cover the rest of the world. Hope you can help.
Info needed for Denmark, Ireland, Portugal and heaps of other places.......
What about South America, Asia , Africa and various ex USSR states.?
Perhaps people could post translations of this article to non
English speaking networks ?
column 1 = Decane (mostly)......kerosene/diesel is a crude oil cut from oil
refineries, boiling point range is app. 180 to 280 C.
May have pink or blue colour added (U.K.).
column 2 = Pentane, Hexane....the same as for column 1, but a boiling point
range of 25 to 200 C .
Slight yellow colour.
column 3 = 60% Hexane + 40% Heptane ? Usallly colourless ?
column 4 = 95% Ethanol + 5% Methanol approx. Usually has purple colour
and bad taste added. May also contain propanol.
Material Safety Data Sheet for Coleman fuel contains:
solvent naphtha (CAS #64742-89-8) 45-50%
aliphatic petroleum distillates (CAS #64742-88-7) 45-50%
xylene (CAS #1330-20-7) 2%
toluene (CAS #108-88-3) 2%
1 2 3 4
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
U.S.A. | kerosene | Gasoline | White Gas | Denatured Alcohol |
+ | | "Gas" | Naptha | Solvent Alcohol |
Canada | | | Coleman Fuel | |
| | | Blazo | |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
U.K. | Paraffin | Petrol | Coleman Fuel | Methylated Spirit |
| | | | "Meths" |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
France | Petrole |"sans plomb"| Petrol a Bruler | Alcool a Bruler |
| | | Essence filtree | Alcool Denature |
| | | Blanche sans plomb| Alcool Methylique |
| | | Essence C | |
| | | "Essence a l'usage| |
| | | domestique" | |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Holland | Petroleum | Benzine | Wasbenzine | Spiritus |
| Lampen-Olie| "Super" | Coolman Fluel | Brand Spiritus |
| |"Loodvrij" | | alkahol |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Germany | Petroleum | Benzin | Kocherbenzin | Spiritus |
| Paraffinol |"Bleifrei" | Feuerzeug Benzin | Brennspiritus |
| |Auto-Benzin| Katalyt Benzin | Methyl Alkohol |
| | | Reinigungsbenzin | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Italy |"Olio de | Benzina | ???????????? | Alcool Denaturo |
| Paraffina" | | | "Spirito de |
| | | | Brucaire" |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Spain | Parafina | Gasolina | | Alcohol Metilico |
| Petroleo | sim plomo | Gasolina | "Alcohol de |
| | | domestica | quemar" (Metilico)|
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sweden | Fotogen | Bensin | Vit Bensin | T-Sprit |
| | | "teknisk bensin" | Rod-Sprit |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Australia| Kerosene | Petrol | Shellite | methylated spirits|
| "Kero" | | White gas | "Meths" "Metho" |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Finland | valopetroli |bensiini | kevytbensiini | denaturoitu sprii |
| | | | Sinol(tm) |
| | | | Marinol(tm) |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
New | Kerosene | Petrol | White Spirit | Methylated Spirit |
Zealand | | | Shellite | |
| | | Callite | |
| | | Britolite | |
| | | Pegasol | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iceland | ????????? | ???????? | Hreinsad Benzin | ???????????? |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Czech | Petrolej | Benzin | Technicky benzin | Denaturovany lih |
Republic | | | |Denaturovany alkohol|
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Norway | Parafin | Bensin | Renset bensin | Rod-Sprit |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
ex-USSR | kerosene | benzine | ????????????????? | Methyl Alcohol |
(Russia)| | | | ("metilovy spirt")|
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Japan | Toh-yu | Gasoline | White Gas | Nen-ryo yoh |
| | | Coleman Fuel | Alcohol |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
South | paraffin | petrol | Benzene | Methylated Spirits |
Africa | | | | "Meths" |
+ | | | | |
Zimbabwe| | | | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Switzerland| ??????? |"Bleifrei"| Reinbenzin | Brennsprit |
| | | Wundbenzin | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Switzerland| Kerosen |"Bleifrei"| Reinbenzin | Brennsprit |
German sp. | | | Wundbenzin | |
part | | | Feuerzeug Benzin | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Holland | Petroleum | Benzine | Coleman fuel | Spiritus |
| Lampen-Olie | Normaal 16| | Brand Spiritus |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
India | Kerosene | Petrol | ?????????? | Meths ???? |
Bhutan | | (Gasoline)| | |
Nepal | | | | |
Pakistan | | | | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Austria | ???????? |"Bleifrei" | ?????????? | ?????????? |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kenya | Paraffin |unleaded gas| ???????? | ???????? |
| kerosene | | | |
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Poland | nafta |"benzyna |"benzyna | Denaturat |
| |bezolowiowa"| rektyfikowana"| alkohol metylowy |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Turkey | Gazyagi | Benzin | WhiteGas | Ispirto |
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Holland
-------
<dirk.vangu
...@cen.jrc.it> writes......
cat 1: Lampen-Olie... sometimes okay, often more like a vegetable oil.
,the 'non-smelling' version is almost always good: "reukloze lampen-olie"
but contains a perfume which makes my stove (Whisper=Lite" clog up once in
a while.
cat 2: "Super" = high octane, "Loodvrij"= unleaded.
cat 3: Wasbenzine, Coolman fluel, both well known
<millen
...@jach.hawaii.edu> writes.......
The name 'coleman fuel' or 'coleman brandstof' is commonly used in Holland (or
The Netherlands). Stangely enough I can't recall a pure Dutch term (I don't
think there is one). It is sold in all outdoor equipment stores and in some
recreational stores ('kampeerwinkels').
Germany
-------
<Noah_Cocc
...@HAMPSTER.BOLTZ.CS.CMU.EDU> writes.......
I spent a year in Germany, and discovered that White Gas, or Coleman
fluid, as we call it here in USA is known as Reinigungsbenzin
(literally, cleaning gas). I purchased it in an Apotheque (Apothecary).
Poland
------
<ja
...@appel012.hydromech.uni-hannover.de> writes.......
USA: Poland:
Kerosene: hm, I am not sure, but try to ask for 'nafta', or express it
slightly longer 'nafta do lamp naftowych', what means that you want
something which is burned in the lamps...
There exists something called 'olej parafinowy' but I do not
know how it works. Better forget it.
'Nafta' burns easily, but if you think of the
fluid of the Indian kerosene kind, which does not burn when
you light a match and drop onto the fluid surface, I am wrong.
Gasoline: 'Benzyna', different octane numbers, leaded: the lower ones are
called 'niebieska benzyna' (blue gasoline), the better
'zolta benzyna' (yellow gasoline),
unleaded gasoline (probably the best when used in stoves)
'benzyna bezolowiowa'. Fuel for diesel engines is oft called
'olej napedowy', or in slang 'diesel'.
White gas: 'benzyna rektyfikowana', 'benzyna oczyszczana', or when not
undestood, 'benzyna - rozpuszczalnik do farb i lakierow',
or 'benzyna do wywabiania plam', what means, that you want a fluid
with which you may remove paint stains or solvent or thinner
for some sort of paints. Beware of 'rozpuszczalnik do farb
olejnych' - thinner for oil paints. Just explain somehow,
that you need it for a stove ('benzynowa maszynka do gotowania',
people use also the name of the German firm: 'juwel').
Denaturated Alcohol: 'Denaturat', 'alkohol metylowy', usually with
a beautiful skull and crossed bones symbol, and with horrible
violet-colour addition. You may try also to burn 'spirytus',
but this is 99 per cent pure alcohol for consumption and
extremely expensive just to use as fuel...
Availability: 'benzyna rektyfikowana' in the shops with the chemical products
what in Poland means, that there is sold everything from the soap
and washing powder up to thinners and paints: 'sklep chemiczny',
'farby i lakiery', etc. Some hardware shops probably too.
There you may ask also for 'nafta', but try to explain,
what you want to do with it... ('do lampy naftowej').
'Denaturat' could be also probably bought there,
but usually you may get it in the liquor shops (yes!) 'monopolowy'
or even in the shops with food or hardware (smaller towns,
villages).
'Benzyna' - fuel stations, but sometimes there are problems when
you come with a PLASTIC bottle, for just 1 liter...
They may say it is dangerous and would not sell you anything.
In such a case try to come with a metal bottle or bigger
(2-5 liter) can (pol.: 'kanister') or try to ask some driver
for help.
Burning qualities: The division of the qualities is clear - 'nafta' for
lamps or stoves, where you may highly pressurize the fuel,
'denaturat' for the slightly old-fashioned alcohol stoves, where
a surface of the liquid burns, 'benzyna rektyfikowana' is probably
the best thing for stoves with limited or no possibility to
pressurize the fuel (Whisperlite, Coleman). 'Benzyna' - if you
have to use it, use the unleaded super ('bezolowiowa super'),
when not available - down the octane scale. 'Diesel' the worst.
Australia
---------
<da
...@menzies.su.edu.au> writes.......
"white spirits" and "white gas" are NOT the same. White spirit
is some kind of cleaning fluid, IF you can get your stove to run on it it
will clog it up fairly quickly.
Most hardware stores sell "Shellite" in one litre plastic bottles Usually
made by "diggers." ( there are other brands but diggers is the most common)
Kerosene and Methylated spirits are usually available from supermarkets, as
well as hardware stores, again under the "diggers" brand. In the Northern
Territory you will often not find Methylated spirits on display. Ask at the
check-out, or counter. Also N.T. (and Qld. ??) Methylated Spirits is dyed
purple, this has no effect on the stove.
Kenya
-----
<awadding
...@acorn.co.uk> writes.......
Paraffin/Kerosene is available everywhere in Kenya, because its what they
use for lighting charcoal cooking fires. Having said that, there was a
desperate shortage of it everywhere in January/February when we were there,
and I suspect that this occurs unpredictably but perhaps quite frequently
from time to time.
Unleaded gas is pretty much unobtainable, but there must
be plenty of diesel about - we saw a tanker of it lying in the road spilling
the stuff everywhere while people variously stood about smoking and waving
traffic onto the edge of the road.
Austria
-------
<awadding
...@acorn.co.uk> writes.......
"Bleifrei" is particularly low octane - 91 or 92, so the stuff most people
use in cars is the higher octane stuff which isn't so nice in stoves.
Spain
-----
<awadding
...@acorn.co.uk> writes.......
Unleaded petrol/gas is "Sin plomo"
India/Bhutan/Nepal/Pakistan
---------------------------
<RKO
...@aardvark.ucs.uoknor.edu> writes........
Petrol(Gasoline) is available at any Petrol Pump. Buy the higher grade if
you are not sure.
Kerosene is available at most roadside grocery shops or "ration" shops.
Methyl Alcohol-Most Drug Stores stock it. I have never used it in any
stove so can't vouch for it.
White Gas-Could never find it.
Switzerland
-----------
<o
...@ulaf.uu.ch> writes........
Most supermarkets throughout the country sell kerosene and methanol. White
gas is available in chemists and pharmacies (Apotheke, Drogerie), but they
might insist on using special bulky glass bottles and will inform you about
the danger of the stuff you buy. You better tell them that you know what
you're doing and keep a funnel at hand to fill your own fuel bottles outside
the shop and return the bottles afterwards. Kerosene and methanol are sold
at about twice the price of normal, unleaded gas (bleifrei), whereas white
gas sells at about 4 times the price of unleaded.
Africa
------
<jew
...@aqua.ccwr.ac.za> writes.........
The most practical stoves for hiking/camping etc in most of Africa are
simple "meths burners" - meths is relatively cheap and availability
isn't usually a problem. Meths stoves can be a bit difficult to get
going if it's cold but I've always managed - even in temperatures well
below freezing.
Paraffin is the most freely available fuel throughout southern Africa - but
I haven't found a small stove that really works with it.
Petrol throughout southern Africa is leaded - it can be used in an emergency
in pressurised stoves, but clogs up the jets really quickly.
White Spirit/Coleman Fuel is rarely available and then only in specialised
camping shops and is really expensive. Benzene is around but you might
have to hunt a bit, it's quite expensive and sometimes has all sorts of
odd additives that stop it burning properly and clog up the jets.
South Africa (Lesotho and Swaziland)
------------------------------------
<jew
...@aqua.ccwr.ac.za> writes.........
Paraffin is freely available at garages and plenty of other stores.
Petrol at garages.
Benzene is available at most hardware stores - beware of buying stuff called
benzine - it doesn't work.
Methylated Spirits is available at most stores except in the Cape Province
where you can only get it at chemists/pharmacies.
Zimbabwe
--------
<jew
...@aqua.ccwr.ac.za> writes.........
Paraffin at most garages and stores.
Petrol at garages - not reccomended - I'm reluctant to run my car on this
stuff!
Benzene at hardware stores - may be difficult to find.
Meths at most hardware stores and chemists and in some other stores.
Japan
-----
<tsuch
...@sedona.intel.com> writes..........
Gasoline is available at gas station. Usually they also have kerosene,
ie. Toh-yu. "Toh" is pronounced like in "TOFU", and "yu" is like "you".
White Gas (most likely the one sold by Japan Coleman) is available at
bigger sports goods retailer. Sometimes also available at hardware
store (again, bigger one). Alcohol is available at drug store. Ask
"Nen-ryo yoh" (the one as fuel), or you will get the one for
disinfection. Pronounce something like "Al-coal" for "Alcohol".
Russia
------
<mtr
...@vmsa.technion.ac.il> writes........
Petrol could be obtained in fuel-station, if you find one. But usually
there are very long lines for fuel and nobody is permitted to buy without
order. TIP: ask driver of lorry/bus/taxi to sale (or just present) several
liters. It usually works if you ask <2-3 liters. If you need more, repeat
procedure. Taxi drivers usually sale benzine about 4-10 times more
expensive than in fuel stations.
Don't try to find white gas. Nobody knows what it is. Learn to use petrol
(if your stove isn't intended for petrol, be ready to clean it in the
field). Trying to buy methyl alchohol (or cheap alchohol) isn't good idea.
Kerosene may be obtainable, but you can never predict it. Besides that some
places don't sale goods to visitors. If so, you can usually ask somebody
in the place to buy it for you.
The best obtainable fuel is a solar. Fuel stations don't sale it to
travelers but most drivers of big lorries let you suck it. Bring house >2 m
long (if you buy petrol from car/bus/... you need to suck it too!)
It is good idea to have somebody speaking Russian and preferably local
language for negotiations. Foreign language and cash may attract crimes.
In general, you usually can find fuel in the initial point of your trip
(you can't bring it in the plane) but it takes time. Consultations are highly
recommended! In 1990 we had to delay start to 20-days mountain expedition
in Tyan'-Shan' for 1 day because we couldn't obtain fuel!
France
------
<I.G.Bat
...@fulcrum.co.uk> writes.......
Coleman fuel is also available as ``Essence C''in French supermarkets
and hardware shops. It's dirt cheap.
It worked fine in a Coleman Peak One and an MSR Whisperlite, with no
fouling or peculiar smell from either or excessive filth from priming
the MSR
``Essence'', alone, is leaded 88 octane petrol.
<awadding
...@acorn.co.uk> writes.......
Petrol/Gasoline in France is called "Essence", but the relevant stuff
for stove fuel is unleaded, which is called "Sans plomb", or, more
easily, just comes out of the green nozzles at filling stations !
Norway
------
<pa
...@lie.uit.no> writes........
Parafin is available at most garages, at times under the name
"Fritids-parafin", or "Lampe-olje" (the latter is a more refined
version, doesn't smell).
Bensin is available at garages, and so is White Spirit.
Rod-Sprit is available at stores selling paint etc. and also Liquour-shops!!!
(even if it is poisonous).
<pa
...@lie.uit.no> writes.....
The problem is the product called "White spirit" in Norwegian. It is a
somewhat
kerosene-like product, but more refined. It is intended for use as paint-
thinner
removing paint-stains etc. It is cleaner and lights easier than kerosene, but
it is not at all comparable to petrol. I use it from time to time as a
substitute
for kerosene in my stove, and it works great.
On the other hand there is "Renset bensin", which is unleaded, highly refined
petrol. It is sold at pharmacies, and is intended for removing stains, and
also
medical use. This product is very expensive, very explosive: not exactly the
ideal
stove fuel.
But what confuses me is: this seems to be the product referred to for a lot of
other countries.
So what do you think? Are you looking for "White spirit" or "Renset bensin" ?
<wittg
...@kjemi.unit.no> writes......
Actually you are looking for something inbetween, my Whispherlight get some
hick'up when using "White spirit" because the petroleum jet is to big for
using "White spirit" directly, the white gas jet is somewhat small, so you
don't get enough fuel through it. Another popular use of "White spirit" is
lighting a barbeque with it.
Never use "Renset bensin" you just waist your money, use unleaded 98
octane fuel. Some gas station sell a gasoline typ with an additive based
on potassium, this one should not be used in MSR's or Coleman's
<exua
...@exu.ericsson.se> writes........
While in Norway and Sweden recently I looked closely at "Renset bensin" and
"tecknisk bensin" for use in my SVEA stove. The Norwegan product was clearly
marked as a mixture (60/40??) of Hexane and Heptane (with 1 or 2 percent of
other "-anes", like pentane). The Swedish product was not labelled as to
contents. I did purchase about 200 ml, good for about 1 hour cooking, but
now I don't recall from which country. There was no problem since the stove
is designed to use explosive fuels. Later I switched to Primus (TM) brand of
butane and a new stove because it was much more available and cheaper.
There are some interesting cultural differences with regard to the "explosive"
fuels.
>It is sold at pharmacies, and is intended for removing stains, and also
>medical use. This product is very expensive, very explosive: not exactly
>the ideal stove fuel.
This is quite true for Norway and Sweden. If you go to a pharmacy and say
you are going to use this product in a stove they will just as likely call
"the men in white coats" to take you away. But if you say you are going to
use it to clean wounds, this is OK.
Now, in the US if you went to a sports store and said you were going to use
Coleman Fuel (TM for extra pure white gasoline) - someone would say you were
very crazy.
<wittg
...@kjemi.unit.no> writes.......
True, the norwegian's get slighty crazy if they someone light
a stove fired by gasoline, normally they move about two meters away.
They learn gasoline == dangerous, kerosene == safe.
Further it is forbidden in Norway to sell stoves
fired by gasoline.
U.S.A
-----
<dnewc
...@whale.st.usm.edu> writes......
"Charcoal lighter" is a clean substitute (for Kerosene) and available
in any store.
U.K.
---
Paraffin available from some garages. Coleman fuel only from some
camping stores.....If you ask for white spirit, you will be given
"Turpentine substitute" ie. paint thinner. Meths from hardware stores.
New Zealand
-----------
White spirit (4 brand names) available from garages. Probably safer to ask
for one of the brand names rather than just "white spirit".
Meths from hardware stores.
Sweden
------
Alan Malkiel <exua
...@exu.ericsson.se> writes......
In Sweden, Vit Bensin is also sold as "teknisk bensin". (Technicial Gasoline)
(It is used as a cleaning solvent, sold in small bottles, and rather
expensive.)
Finland
-------
kira
...@gamma.hut.fi writes.......
Valopetroli, bensiini and sprii are generic names, Sinol and
Marinol are brand names, but also in common use.
mk59
...@cs.tut.fi writes........
White Gas (kevytbensiini) is apparently very hard to find (maybe
because nobody uses it here). According to manufacturer's info
Sinol(tm) is for unpressurized stoves (Trangia etc.) while Marinol(tm)
is for pressurized stoves (Optimus? never seen one), but in practice
they should be interchangeable.
Czech Republic
--------------
<akh...@sequent.com> writes
Petrolej, Benzin, Technicky benzin, Denaturovany lih or Denaturovany alkohol
should be commonly available in 'Drogerie' (Drug store) or 'Barvy-Laky'
(Paints) stores.
Some notes on diesel fuel
-------------------------
<awadding
...@acorn.co.uk> writes.......
Don't forget that some multifuel stoves will run on Diesel, which has
the advantage of a very high calorific value per unit mass. In UK, this
is "Diesel" or "DERV", the latter for road vehicles specifically. Its
also possible to get hold of agricultural or "Red Diesel", which is
free of excise duty, but under no circumstances should you use it in
a road vehicle ! In Spain, diesel is "Gazoleo A".
I'm also interested in the availability of fuels in other countries.
Please post or email any suggestions. I'll post updates.
Mike Buckler
mbuck...@chenov1.auckland.ac.nz
s...@ccu1.auckland.ac.nz
Subject: Re: transporting fuel
Doing so aboard an aircraft is a felony.
US HMR 175-6:
Federal law forbids the carriage of hazardous materials aboard aircraft
in your luggage or on your person.
A violation can result in penalties of up to $25,000 and five years
imprisonment. (49 U.S.C. 1809)
Hazardous materials include explosives, compressed gases, flammable
liquids and solids, oxidizers, poisons, corrosives, and radioactive
materials.
It's also dangerous as hell. Be forewarned.
Hey let's vote (achieve consensus) on taking stove fuel in airliners.
# that is silly
Here is the text of the Federal (FAA) regulations governing taking empty
fuel bottles on Airplanes:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
§ 175.26 Notification at air passenger facilities of hazardous
materials restrictions.
{New-93-9 Revised Sept. 27, 1993, effective Oct. 1, 1993.}
(a) Each aircraft operator who engages in for-hire transportation
of passengers shall display notices of the requirements applicable to
the carriage of hazardous materials aboard aircraft, and the penalties
for failure to comply with those requirements. Each notice must be
legible, and be prominently displayed so that it can be seen by
passengers in locations where the aircraft operator issues tickets,
checks baggage, and maintains aircraft boarding areas.
{Beginning of old text revised Sept. 27, 1993}
175.25 Informing passengers about hazardous materials restrictions.
(a) Each aircraft operator who engages in for hire transportation
of passengers shall display notices to passengers concerning the
requirements and penalties associated with the carriage of hazardous
materials aboard aircraft. Such a notice shall be prominently
displayed in each location at an airport where the aircraft operator
issues tickets, checks baggage, and maintains aircraft boarding areas.
(1) Each notice must contain the following information:
Federal law forbids the carriage of hazardous materials aboard
aircraft in your luggage or on your person.
A violation can result in penalties of up to $25,000 and 5 years
imprisonment. (49 U.S.C. 1809)
Hazardous materials include explosives, compressed gases, flammable
liquids and solids, oxidizers, poisons, corrosives and radioactive
materials.
Examples: Paints, lighter fluid, fireworks, tear gases, oxygen
bottles, and radiopharmaceuticals.
There are special exceptions for small quantities (up to 75 ounces
total) of medicinal and toilet articles carried in your luggage and
certain smoking materials carried on your person.
For further information contact your airline representative.
(2) The information contained in paragraph (a)(1) of this
section must be printed:
(i) In legible English;
(ii) In lettering of at least 1 cm (0.4 inch) in height for
the first three paragraphs and 6.0 mm (0.2 inch) in height for the
last three paragraphs; and
(iii) On a background of contrasting color.
(3) Size and color of the notice are optional. Additional
information, if not inconsistent with required information, may be
included.
[Amdt. 175-12, 45 FR 13091, Feb. 28, 1980, as amended by 175-23, 47
FR 43066, Sept. 30, 1982; Amdt. 175-47, 55 FR 52685, Dec. 21, 1990;
Amdt. 175-50, 58 FR 50505, Sept. 27, 1993]
============================================================
§ 173.29 Empty packagings
(a) General. Except as otherwise provided in this section, an empty
packaging containing only the residue of a hazardous material shall be
offered for transportation and transported in the same manner as when
it previously contained a greater quantity of that hazardous material.
(b) Notwithstanding the requirements of paragraph (a) of this
section, an empty packaging is not subject to any other requirements
of this subchapter if it conforms to the following provisions:
(1) Any hazardous material shipping name and identification
number markings, and any hazard warning labels or placards are
removed, obliterated, or securely covered in transportation. This
provision does not apply to transportation in a transport vehicle or a
freight container if the packaging is not visible during
transportation and the packaging is loaded by the shipper and unloaded
by the shipper or consignee;
(2) The packaging -
(i) Is unused;
(ii) Is sufficiently cleaned of residue and purged of vapors
to remove any potential hazard;
(iii) Is refilled with a material which is not hazardous to
such an extent that any residue remaining in the packaging no longer
poses a hazard; or
(iv) Contains only the residue of -
(A) An ORM-D material; or
(B) A nonflammable gas with no subsidiary hazard at an
absolute pressure less than 276 kPa (40 psia); at 21ø C (70ø F); and
49 CFR Ch. I (12-31-91 Edition)
sect. 173.29 Empty Packagings.
(a) General. Except as otherwise provided in this section, an empty
packaging containing only the residue of a hazardous material shall be
offered for transportation and transported in the same manner as when it
previously contained a greater quantity of that hazardous material.
(b) Notwithstanding the requirements of paragraph (a) of this section,
an empty packaging is not subject to any other requirements of this sub-
chapter if it conforms to the following provisions:
(1) Any hazardous material shipping name and identification number
markings, and any hazard warning labels or placards are removed, obliter-
ated, or securely covered in transportation. This provision does not
apply to transporation in a transport vehicle or a freight container if
the packaging is not visible during transportation and the packaging is
loaded and unloaded by the shipper or consignee;
(2) The packaging--
(i) Is unused;
(ii) Is sufficiently cleaned of residue and purged of vapors to remove
any potential hazard;
(iii) Is refilled with a material which is not hazardous to such an
extent that any residue remaining in the packaging no longer poses a
hazard; or
(iv) Contains only the residue of -
(A) An ORM-D material; or
(B) A non-flammable gas with no subsidiary hazard at an absolute
pressure less than 276 kPa (40 psia); at 21 degrees C (70 degrees F); and
(3) Any material contained in the packaging does not meet the defin-
ition in sect. 171.8 of this subchapter for either a hazardous substance
or a hazardous waste.
(c) A non-bulk packaging containing only the residue of a hazardous
material covered by Table 2 of sect. 172.504 of this subchapter --
(1) Does not have to be included in determining the applicability of
the placarding requirements of subpart F of part 172 of this subchapter;
and
(2) Is not subject to the shipping paper requirements of this subchap-
ter when collected and transported by a contract or private carrier for
reconditioning; remanufacture or reuse.
(d) Notwithstanding the stowage requirements in Column 10a of the
sect. 172.101 Table for transportation by vessel, an empty drum or cy-
linder may be stowed on deck or under deck.
(e) Specific provisions for describing an empty packaging on a shipping
paper appear in sect. 172.203(e) of this subchapter.
(f) An empty tank car must conform to the placarding requirements spec-
ified in sect. 172.510(c) of this subchapter.
(g) A package which contains a residue of an elevated temperature mater-
ial may remain marked in the same manner as when it contained a greater
amount of the material even though it no longer meets the definition in
sect. 171.8 of this subchapter for an elevated temperature material.
Effective Date note: by Amdt 173-227, 56 FR 49989, Oct 2 1991. sect
173.29 was amended by adding paragraph (g), effective March 30 1992.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
The most important part seems to be sect. 173.29(b).
Transporting fuel on a plane, while legal, is a *lot* of trouble and
not worth it, except when taking an Alaska Bush Plane. FAA regulations
for that are easier. Your Alaskan Bush Pilot can give you the details.
I don't have the text for those regulations at hand.
Even though the FAA doesn't prohibit it, the Airlines can refuse to
transport any of this regardless. It isn't just low-aptitude baggage
checkin staff. When they made me leave my fuel bottle behind, the
gal called up their hazardous materials phone number first. I am
grateful that I did not have to leave my MSR stove behind.
If you need a quart of white gas, try talking to the store management
at your arrival city. They, like grocers, may agree to sell you part of
a can, from a quantity under the counter, at a little higher per-unit cost.
David W Olson, my contribution
First, the penalties:
If you transport a hazardous material on a commercial airline flight
without having that material properly marked and contained in a special
shipping container, you can be fined a MINIMUM of $10,000. And that
fine applies to EACH occurance. What is a hazardous material? White
gasoline, unleaded gasoline, Coleman fuel, and a variety of others. To
complicate matters further, individual airlines may have additional items
on the list which they consider hazardous.
Are backpacking stoves classified as "proper shipping containers"? The
answer is NO!
How can you find out if your container is an authorized container? The
box you purchased the unit in should have a "UN" (United Nations) number
which identifies its classification. You also need the UN number for
the fuel it will contain. Then you have to dig through the CFR to identify
how it must be shipped. Within the CFR you can find Part 172, section
101 which applies to "Special Packing/Shipping Authorization". I do
not know what this section contains since I have not researched it yet.
Then you need to acquire a little diatribe from the International Civil
Aviation Organization entitled "Technical Instruction for Safe Transport
of Dangerous Goods by Air". You can acquire a copy of this TI by contacting
a company called "Labelmaster" at 1-800-621-5808. I suspect they will
charge you a fee for aquiring the TI.
Suprisingly, Delores Lucas in the Dangerous Goods Branch mentioned that
she has never heard of anyone asking this question before. She recommended
that I contact DOT and request an official interpretation of the regs.
Andy
Coleman fuel is usually tinted green, as is Wal-Mart fuel.
Gasoline is usually tinted yellow, but I've seen it tinted pink for
high octane.
Deodorized kerosene is often tinted pink (Aladdin fuel) or bright
red/green/yellow/blue so it looks good in glass kerosene lamps.
[
An interesting lingistic digression (curiosity to real linguists as
their field has moved on unlike the net) is to see the presumption that
an empty fuel bottle is somehow safer. It was Benjamin Whorf, a fire
investigator for an insurance company who was an amateur student of SW Indian
languages who wrote about this. Vapor is frequently more dangerous
(depending on the mixing ratio with air). MIT Press Books still prints
Whorf's writings. But he would be most amused at this net topic.
This relates to language and the meaning of words and names relating to the
appreciation of natural beauty.
--enm
]
Sec 12072 California Penal Code provides for "transfers between
unlicenced persons" as follows:
Subsection (d) Where neither party to the transaction holds a
dealer's licence ......in order for a person to sell or otherwise
transfer a firearm, the parties to the transaction shall complete the
transaction through either of the following:
(1) A licenced dealer pursuant to Section 12082
(2) A law enforcement agency pursuant to Section 12084
Subsection (f) Except as provided....(sales to disqualified
persons)..., violation of this section is a misdemeanor.
The Constitution of the United States, Article I, Section 8, clause 16
states:
"The Congress shall have Power * * * To provide for organizing, arming,
and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may
be employed in the Service of the United States..."
From: jo...@leopard.cs.byu.edu (Mike Jones)
Subject: Re: Knees that hurt while walking downhill, summary.
Thanks for the good advice, I've been reading this newsgroup for a
while, and this was the response I hoped to get. A few people asked
for summaries, so here is "distilled wisdom" on knees that hurt while
walking downhill:
1. Go see a doctor, or a physcical therapist. Knee problems aren't
all the same and what works for one, might not work for the other.
I'm going to see the family Doctor today (I had the appointment before I
posted, I wanted to get some net.wisdom first though).
2. Use trekking poles. I've never seen them in Utah, but they appear
to be more common outside the USA. Leki was the only brand
recommended by name. I like this idea, it makes sense. Anyone know
where I can get Leki poles in Utah? (Getting ski poles is no problem
in Utah).
3. If the doctor assigns excercises, do them. If the doctor assigns
no exercises, don't do them.
4. Cross train. Cycling can help some knee problems (see a dr. first).
I cycle a bit and it helps me stay conditioned when I can't hike.
4.25 Use good technique when going downhill. Locking your knees and
pounding them with your weight on a descent won't help. Keep knees
bent and take smaller steps. This might mean going slower.
4.5 Use orthotics. Several people recommended them.
5. Knee problems don't always end one's hiking career. I love Utah
because of the mountains. Looks like I can still enjoy it.
Newsgroups: rec.backcountry
From: g...@cccs.umn.edu ()
Subject: Hantavirus on the Appalachian Trail
Message-ID: <D0CH97....@news.cis.umn.edu>
Organization: University of Minnesota, Twin Cities
Date: Mon, 5 Dec 1994 15:50:04 GMT
Here's an entry for rec.backcountry.risks.
The essence is: "minimiz(e) exposure to rodents and their excreta.
Persons engaged in outdoor activities such as camping or hiking should
take precautions to reduce contact with rodents"
EXTRACTED FROM:
..the final electronic text from the Morbidity and Mortality
Weekly Report (MMWR), vol. 43, no. 47, dated December 2, 1994. The MMWR
is published by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, Public
Health Service, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), Atlanta,
Georgia.
Hantavirus Pulmonary Syndrome -- Virginia, 1993
Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome (HPS) was first recognized in June 1993
as a result of the investigation of a cluster of fatal cases of adult
respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS) in the southwestern United States (1).
During that month, a 61-year-old man was admitted to a hospital in southern
Pennsylvania with ARDS; recent testing of all available specimens from this
patient has confirmed the diagnosis of HPS. This report summarizes the case
investigation.
When hospitalized on June 28, 1993, the man reported a 4-day history
of fever, chills, headache, myalgia, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. After
admission, he became hypotensive and increasingly short of breath and was
transferred to a tertiary-care medical center. Laboratory findings included
leukocytosis (white blood cell count 25,300/mm3), hemoconcentration
(hemoglobin of 20.0 g/L), thrombocytopenia (platelet count 65,000/mm3), and
elevated blood urea nitrogen, creatinine (peak value 6.8 ug/dL),
prothrombin time, activated partial thromboplastin time, aspartate
aminotransferase (peak value 8500 U/L), lactic dehydrogenase, and lipase
levels. A chest radiograph indicated bilateral diffuse infiltrates. During
his prolonged hospital course, he required respiratory and circulatory
support and hemodialysis. He was discharged on July 22, 1993.
An enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay with heterologous antigens
performed on serum samples obtained on July 2 and July 20 were highly
suspect for hantavirus antibodies. Subsequent retesting of these samples,
as well as of an additional sample obtained in September 1994, with Sin
Nombre virus (SNV) antigens confirmed the diagnosis of HPS.
In April 1993, the patient had started hiking on the Appalachian Trail
northbound from Georgia through North Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, and
West Virginia. From May 13 through June 20, he hiked primarily along the
Appalachian Trail in Virginia and reported evidence of mice, including
excreta and rodent traps in shelters and bunkhouses.
To further characterize the prevalence of hantavirus in local rodent
populations, the offices of Epidemiology and Environmental Health of the
Virginia Department of Health, local health departments, the National Park
Service, and CDC are conducting rodent trapping.
Reported by: BH Hamory, MD, C Zwillich, MD, T Bollard, MD, JO Ballard, MD,
The Milton S Hershey Medical Center, Hershey; M Connor, DO, Chambersberg
Hospital, Chambersberg; P Lurie, MD, M Moll, MD, J Rankin, DVM, State
Epidemiologist, Pennsylvania Dept of Health. C Smith, MD, New River Health
District, Radford; S Jenkins, VMD, E Barrett, DMD, GB Miller, Jr, MD, State
Epidemiologist, Virginia Dept of Health. W Frampton, DVM, S Lanser MPH, CR
Nichols, MPA, State Epidemiologist, Utah Dept of Health. DT King, Harpers
Ferry, West Virginia; A Kingsbury, MS, Washington, DC, National Park
Service, US Dept of the Interior. Special Pathogens Br, Div of Viral and
Rickettsial Diseases, National Center for Infectious Diseases, CDC.
Editorial Note: This report describes the first known case of HPS in the
mid-Atlantic states. The patient's infection probably was acquired along
the Appalachian Trail in Virginia, an area within the range of habitation
of the primary rodent reservoir of SNV, Peromyscus maniculatus (deer
mouse). The prodromal illness and respiratory failure are consistent with
HPS (2); the renal involvement characteristic of Eurasian hemorrhagic fever
with renal syndrome (HFRS) has not been typical of HPS. Moderate elevations
( greater than 2.5 ug/dL) in serum creatinine have occurred in only 10% of
fatal cases of HPS; prominent renal involvement, such as that which
occurred in this patient, has been documented only in two cases from the
southeastern United States, both of which are believed to have been
associated with hantaviruses other than SNV (provisionally named Black
Creek Canal virus and Bayou virus) (3,4). Thus, the marked liver
transaminase elevation in this patient has not been a prominent feature in
other cases of HPS, although the prominent liver dysfunction has occurred
with HFRS (5,6). However, because both renal and hepatic dysfunction can
be caused by antecedent hypotension and other factors, additional case
investigation is ongoing to clarify the relevance of these findings.
Since June 1993, when HPS was first recognized in the United States,
98 cases have been identified in 21 states. The mean age of case-patients
has been 35.1 years (range: 12-69 years), and the case-fatality rate is
52%; 52 (54%) cases have occurred in males. The earliest retrospectively
identified case, inferred by a history of a compatible illness and elevated
IgG titers detected for SNV, occurred in a 38-year-old man in Utah in 1959.
The findings in this report extend the geographic area for risk of
human infection with hantaviruses in the contiguous United States and
emphasize the continued importance of minimizing exposure to rodents and
their excreta. Persons engaged in outdoor activities such as camping or
hiking should take precautions to reduce contact with rodents (7). National
surveillance for HPS continues to characterize the spectrum of clinical
illness associated with SNV and identify additional pathogenic hantaviruses
and rodent hosts. Suspected cases of HPS should be reported through local
and state health departments for evaluation and investigation.
References
1. CDC. Outbreak of acute illness--southwestern United States, 1993. MMWR
1993;42:421-4.
2. Duchin JS, Koster FT, Peters CJ, et al. Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome:
a clinical description of 17 patients with a newly recognized disease. N
Engl J Med 1994;330:949-55.
3. CDC. Newly identified hantavirus--Florida, 1994. MMWR 1994;43:99,105.
4. CDC. Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome--northeastern United States, 1994.
MMWR 1994;43:548-9,555-6.
5. Chan YC, Wong TW, Yap EH, et al. Haemorrhagic fever with renal syndrome
involving the liver. Med J Aust 1987;147:248-9.
6. Elisaf M, Stefanaki S, Repanti M, Korakis H, Tsianos E, Siamopoulos KC.
Liver involvement in hemorrhagic fever with renal syndrome. J Clin
Gastroenterology 1993;17:33-7.
7. CDC. Hantavirus infection--southwestern United States: interim
recommendations for risk reduction. MMWR 1993;42(no. RR-11).
There are several means of electronic communication available
for use in the backcountry. &nbs
