On Nov 7, 9:08 am, Bill Snyder <bsny...@airmail.net> wrote:
> On Sat, 7 Nov 2009 07:40:20 -0800 (PST), Will in New Haven > <bill.re...@taylorandfrancis.com> wrote: > >Then Iris Dement and Joan Baez get to sing it and the song no longer > >has anything like agreed-upon lyrics.
> Baez undoubtedly heard it on a train to Richmond, and couldn't > quite make out the words in such noisy surroundings.
A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
In article <ff1d109e-50b4-470e-b51a-3616e1cd3...@x6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>,
Quadibloc <jsav...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote: > On Nov 7, 9:08 am, Bill Snyder <bsny...@airmail.net> wrote: > > On Sat, 7 Nov 2009 07:40:20 -0800 (PST), Will in New Haven > > <bill.re...@taylorandfrancis.com> wrote:
> > >Then Iris Dement and Joan Baez get to sing it and the song no longer > > >has anything like agreed-upon lyrics.
> > Baez undoubtedly heard it on a train to Richmond, and couldn't > > quite make out the words in such noisy surroundings.
> A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", her > most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it.
-- Erilar, biblioholic
bib-li-o-hol-ism [<Gr biblion] n. [BIBLIO + HOLISM] books, of books: habitual longing to purchase, read, store, admire, and consume books in excess.
> > On Nov 7, 9:08 am, Bill Snyder <bsny...@airmail.net> wrote: > > > On Sat, 7 Nov 2009 07:40:20 -0800 (PST), Will in New Haven > > > <bill.re...@taylorandfrancis.com> wrote:
> > > > Then Iris Dement and Joan Baez get to sing it and the song no > > > > longer has anything like agreed-upon lyrics.
> > > Baez undoubtedly heard it on a train to Richmond, and couldn't > > > quite make out the words in such noisy surroundings.
> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", > > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it.
That's the case for many, if not most, people. It's to the point where her changed lyrics are almost the standard. This is in spite of the fact that she does the original ones in her performances these days.
The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The Band.
Brian
-- Day 279 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
>> In article >> <ff1d109e-50b4-470e-b51a-3616e1cd3...@x6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, >> Quadibloc <jsav...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote:
>> > On Nov 7, 9:08 am, Bill Snyder <bsny...@airmail.net> wrote: >> > > On Sat, 7 Nov 2009 07:40:20 -0800 (PST), Will in New Haven >> > > <bill.re...@taylorandfrancis.com> wrote:
>> > > > Then Iris Dement and Joan Baez get to sing it and the song no >> > > > longer has anything like agreed-upon lyrics.
>> > > Baez undoubtedly heard it on a train to Richmond, and couldn't >> > > quite make out the words in such noisy surroundings.
>> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
>> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it.
>That's the case for many, if not most, people. It's to the point where >her changed lyrics are almost the standard. This is in spite of the >fact that she does the original ones in her performances these days.
>The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The Band.
And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first Baez version.
Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote: > On 8 Nov 2009 19:00:25 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuse...@yahoo.com> > wrote:
> > erilar wrote:
> >> In article > >> <ff1d109e-50b4-470e-b51a-3616e1cd3...@x6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, > >> Quadibloc <jsav...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote: > >> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", > >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
> >> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it. > > The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The > > Band.
> And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first > Baez version.
Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I assumed there must be a train named for the General.
Brian
-- Day 279 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
> > >> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", > > >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
> > >> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it.
> > > The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The > > > Band.
> > And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first > > Baez version.
> Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the > Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I > assumed there must be a train named for the General.
Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a mistaken lead?
Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally well be a paddle steamer.
>> > >> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", >> > >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
>> > >> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it.
>> > > The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The >> > > Band.
>> > And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first >> > Baez version.
>> Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A >> different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the >> Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I >> assumed there must be a train named for the General.
>Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a >mistaken lead?
>Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally >well be a paddle steamer.
It was. "Waiting for the Robert E. Lee" was a very popular song in its time, although unlikely to appeal now. Written in 1913, music by Lewis F. Muir, lyrics by L. Wolfe Gilbert.
Robert Carnegie wrote: > Default User wrote: > > Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A > > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes > > the Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, > > I assumed there must be a train named for the General.
> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a > mistaken lead?
> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally > well be a paddle steamer.
What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in Virginia?
Brian
-- Day 279 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
>>> Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A >>> different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes >>> the Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, >>> I assumed there must be a train named for the General.
>> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a >> mistaken lead?
>> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally >> well be a paddle steamer.
> What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in > Virginia?
>> > Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A >> > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes >> > the Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, >> > I assumed there must be a train named for the General.
>> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a >> mistaken lead?
>> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally >> well be a paddle steamer.
>What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in >Virginia?
I believe Virgil was in Tennessee, in even the Baez version, at that point. (And _General_ Robert E. Lee was in Virginia.)
-- Bill Snyder [This space unintentionally left blank]
> > > >> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", > > > >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
> > > >> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it.
> > > > The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The > > > > Band.
> > > And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first > > > Baez version.
> > Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A > > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the > > Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I > > assumed there must be a train named for the General.
> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a > mistaken lead?
> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally > well be a paddle steamer.
I think I "heard" it as that paddle steamer.
-- Erilar, biblioholic
bib-li-o-hol-ism [<Gr biblion] n. [BIBLIO + HOLISM] books, of books: habitual longing to purchase, read, store, admire, and consume books in excess.
>> > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes >> > the Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, >> > I assumed there must be a train named for the General.
>> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a >> mistaken lead?
>> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally >> well be a paddle steamer.
> I think I "heard" it as that paddle steamer.
The folk song that Lehrer is parodying has people waiting -on the levee- for the Robert E. Lee, which definitely makes it a boat instead of a train. Trust me, I live in the South.
> Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote: > > On 8 Nov 2009 19:00:25 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuse...@yahoo.com> > > wrote:
> > > erilar wrote:
> > >> In article > > >> <ff1d109e-50b4-470e-b51a-3616e1cd3...@x6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, > > >> Quadibloc <jsav...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote: > > >> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", > > >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
> > >> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it. > > > The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The > > > Band.
> > And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first > > Baez version.
> Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the > Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I > assumed there must be a train named for the General.
> Brian
> -- > Day 279 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
Hmm. I always thought of that line as referring to the General, but with a sort of weird honorific in front of his name (like, "the one and only Robert E. Lee" only different).
> On Nov 8, 3:39 pm, "Default User" <defaultuse...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Lawrence Watt-Evans wrote: > > > On 8 Nov 2009 19:00:25 GMT, "Default User" <defaultuse...@yahoo.com> > > > wrote:
> > > > erilar wrote:
> > > >> In article > > > >> <ff1d109e-50b4-470e-b51a-3616e1cd3...@x6g2000prc.googlegroups.com>, > > > >> Quadibloc <jsav...@ecn.ab.ca> wrote: > > > >> > A reference, of course, to "The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down", > > > >> > her most famous case of lyrics-mangling.
> > > >> Really? I never heard of the song before she sang it. > > > > The original was written by Robbie Robertson and performed by The > > > > Band.
> > > And in the original the lyrics actually make sense, unlike the first > > > Baez version.
> > Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A > > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the > > Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I > > assumed there must be a train named for the General.
> > Brian
> > -- > > Day 279 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
> Hmm. I always thought of that line as referring to the General, but > with a sort of weird honorific in front of his name (like, "the one > and only Robert E. Lee" only different).
> Chris
I suppose if my surname was Ely, I'd have to tell people that I'm not "the" Robert E. Lee, I'm just "a" Robert Ely.
(There are people on this globe named Robert Ely, it appears. I expect some of them get the joke and some of them don't.)
Bill Snyder wrote: > On 9 Nov 2009 08:48:38 GMT, "Default User" > <defaultuse...@yahoo.com> wrote: > > What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in > > Virginia?
> I believe Virgil was in Tennessee, in even the Baez version, at > that point. (And General Robert E. Lee was in Virginia.)
Ah, yes. At any rate, by 1865 (the time of the events) the Union controlled the entire Mississippi River. Also, it seems that the riverboat wasn't constructed until after the war, in 1866.
Brian
-- Day 280 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
>> On 9 Nov 2009 08:48:38 GMT, "Default User" >> <defaultuse...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in >> > Virginia?
>> I believe Virgil was in Tennessee, in even the Baez version, at >> that point. (And General Robert E. Lee was in Virginia.)
>Ah, yes. At any rate, by 1865 (the time of the events) the Union >controlled the entire Mississippi River. Also, it seems that the >riverboat wasn't constructed until after the war, in 1866.
I'd assumed the "back with my wife in Tennessee" part *was* after the war. But at any rate, The Band's position is that there's no "the" in there; it's just "Robert E. Lee." (Lee was never in Tennessee after the war, but it seems he was sighted all over the South, in places he was never within five hundred miles of. There are even references to Lincoln being seen various places in the North well after his assassination. They were apparently the Elvis and Bigfoot of their day.)
-- Bill Snyder [This space unintentionally left blank]
> >> > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes > >> > the Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, > >> > I assumed there must be a train named for the General.
> >> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a > >> mistaken lead?
> >> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally > >> well be a paddle steamer.
> > I think I "heard" it as that paddle steamer.
> The folk song that Lehrer is parodying has people waiting -on the levee- > for the Robert E. Lee, which definitely makes it a boat instead of a > train. Trust me, I live in the South.
Whoops. I believe he said "it was never there on time", and so I assumed -
On Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:48:38 +0000, Default User wrote: > Robert Carnegie wrote:
>> Default User wrote:
>> > Well, most of her changes made sense in an eggcorny sort of way. A >> > different sense, to be sure. The most problematic was "There goes the >> > Robert E. Lee", versus "There goes Robert E. Lee". At the time, I >> > assumed there must be a train named for the General.
>> Uh, I believed Tom Lehrer referred to such, was he following a mistaken >> lead?
>> Robert mentally reviews the song in question in case it could equally >> well be a paddle steamer.
> What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in > Virginia?
Back when paddle-wheel steamboats were state-of-the-art transportation, they were used on many different rivers, not just the Mississippi. There were even some paddle-wheel-driven ocean-going ships.
-- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com "Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to think at all." -- Hypatia of Alexandria
John F. Eldredge wrote: > On Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:48:38 +0000, Default User wrote: > > What would a Mississippi River paddlewheel steamboat be doing in > > Virginia?
> Back when paddle-wheel steamboats were state-of-the-art > transportation, they were used on many different rivers, not just the > Mississippi. There were even some paddle-wheel-driven ocean-going > ships.
The Robert. E. Lee was not one of those. Moot anyway, as it wasn't constructed until after the war had ended.
Brian
-- Day 282 of the "no grouchy usenet posts" project
