Just tried the demo of this on PC and, while 3rd person action games aren't my favourite, this looks like a rare bit of action quality on PC. What normally puts me off straight away with multi-platform games is that the controls are horrible on the PC. But the controls here were no problem at all. If it was purely a fighting game I'd have given up straight away but there appear to be other elements to the game - stealth, silent kills, puzzles. And the character animation,voicing is top class. Not out (in uk) until 18 September. -- Rab
<music...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote: >Just tried the demo of this on PC and, while 3rd person action games aren't >my favourite, this looks like a rare bit of action quality on PC. >What normally puts me off straight away with multi-platform games is that >the controls are horrible on the PC. But the controls here were no problem >at all. If it was purely a fighting game I'd have given up straight away >but there appear to be other elements to the game - stealth, silent kills, >puzzles. And the character animation,voicing is top class. >Not out (in uk) until 18 September.
I too am put off by many of the action games that are multi-platform. Even though mouse+keyboard works fine with most of them in the sense that there is nothing restricting you from binding controls to a keyboard key, in some games you get a sense that you're not playing the game the way it's meant to be played.
The answer is to get a 360 controller for the PC.. in fact, after you do, go back and load up some old multi-platform games that didn't appeal to you the first time around and see if you like them better. Before I got the 360 controller, I foolishly thought a gamepad was pretty much a gamepad..I would plug in the trusty Logitech Dual Action, which I always liked the overall feel of, but many games still felt wrong and it was hard to put my finger on why.
I finally ended up getting a 360 controller to play GTA IV. The 360 was a must-have there, because of the index-finger throttle controls which my existing game pad only had buttons for (always fully on or off doesn't make for a very realistic car throttle and makes it harder to control). I started seeing what I had been missing in other games.
Part of it may be that the games just feel "well-calibrated" for the 360 controller with no tweaking required.
Don't get me wrong, for first-person games the mouse and keyboard is ar superior. There are some shooters that "work fine" with the 360 that I'm simply unwilling to give up the finer aiming control of the mouse for. But for 3rd person action games and button mashers there is definately something to be said for sitting back in the chair with a wireless controller, especially when it's the exact controller the game was designed for. Plus, if you've got a reasonably recent PC and good video card, you've basically got a way better Xbox than the Xbox.
On Fri, 28 Aug 2009 09:05:57 -0700, Beano <be...@SPAMTRAP.net> wrote: >On Fri, 28 Aug 2009 09:52:04 +0100, "Musicrab" ><music...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>>Just tried the demo of this on PC and, while 3rd person action games aren't >>my favourite, this looks like a rare bit of action quality on PC. >>What normally puts me off straight away with multi-platform games is that >>the controls are horrible on the PC. But the controls here were no problem >>at all. If it was purely a fighting game I'd have given up straight away >>but there appear to be other elements to the game - stealth, silent kills, >>puzzles. And the character animation,voicing is top class. >>Not out (in uk) until 18 September.
>PC has gamepads too and both 360 and PS3 gamepads will work on the PC >also. 360 gamepad has official driver but the PS3 gamepad you have to >download a free 3rd party driver.
There are many gamepads that "will work" with the crop of games that I would label as "ammed at consoles, yet appear on the PC with far superior graphics". In fact I have an old piece of crap generic gamepad which will work with pretty much anything. But even the Logitech Dual Action, which I would rate as a top-rung gamepad, does not feel the same as the 360 controller in games that are specificially tested with the 360 controller. With enough tweaking and screwing around, a lot of things will work.. the difference with the 360 controller is that a lot of these games just seem to be pre-calibrated for it out of the box, to the point the game is laid out for the controller -- not only that, but the buttons that do such-and- such in one game do same in a different title from a different vendor, much like the console experience.
All of that aside I have to admit I've never tried a PS/3 controller. I also confess to having played several popular console ports with a mouse+keyboard, which might choose again if I had it to do over. One example is Assassins Creed... when it came out I read all the great press and I have to admit the graphics/physics were nice, but at the time I didn't have the 360 controller, and playing with the mouse/keyboard didn't really draw me in. I have not yet loaded that particular one up with the 360 controller, but I will eventually because I think that's how it was meant to be played. I played maybe a total of 3 hrs with the mouse/keyboard before leaving it alone for a year or more.
For first person shooters, RTS games, certain RPGs etc mouse and keyboard is simply unbeatable. So what does that leave? Driving games, sports games and button mashers with dumbed down controls and even arcadish flight games like HAWX that work wtih a controller. Summarizing these genres in a newsgroup makes them sound like not much fun, but they can be if experienced the way the game was meant to be played. What's ironic about the PC + 360 controller experience is that they tend to be not only the way the game was meant to be played, but a vastly improved and refined version of same. I tried playing GTA iV with mouse+keyboard and just couldnt enjoy myself much.. controller? Different story. Like I said, a reasonably recent PC is a much better xbox than an xbox.
As author of this article I grant free usage of cut-n-paste rights as long as the original article is kept in tact :)
<music...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote: >Just tried the demo of this on PC and, while 3rd person action games aren't >my favourite, this looks like a rare bit of action quality on PC. >What normally puts me off straight away with multi-platform games is that >the controls are horrible on the PC. But the controls here were no problem >at all. If it was purely a fighting game I'd have given up straight away >but there appear to be other elements to the game - stealth, silent kills, >puzzles. And the character animation,voicing is top class. >Not out (in uk) until 18 September.
Already out on the consoles - I spent about 8 hours on the 360 version last night. :)
Fantastic game - if your PC can handle the demo OK, it's well worth getting. If not, buy a 360 or PS3. :)
On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 09:22:47 -0700, Beano <be...@SPAMTRAP.net> wrote: >On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 03:22:20 -0400, Kory <k0...@none.com> wrote:
>>For first person shooters, RTS games, certain RPGs etc mouse and >>keyboard is simply unbeatable. So what does that leave? Driving >>games, sports games and button mashers with dumbed down controls and >>even arcadish flight games like HAWX that work wtih a controller. >>Summarizing these genres in a newsgroup makes them sound like not much >>fun, but they can be if experienced the way the game was meant to be >>played. What's ironic about the PC + 360 controller experience is >>that they tend to be not only the way the game was meant to be played, >>but a vastly improved and refined version of same. I tried playing >>GTA iV with mouse+keyboard and just couldnt enjoy myself much.. >>controller? Different story. Like I said, a reasonably recent PC is >>a much better xbox than an xbox.
>You need the right tolls for the job. At my disposal I have Saitek X52 >flight control system for flight sims. Microsoft Forcefeedback2 stick >for flight sims. Microsoft ForceFeedback steering wheels and pedals >for racing sims. TrackIR for flight sims. racing sims, and ArmA2. 3 >gamepads for sports games (Gravis, PS3 and Logitech Dual Acion). Then >of course the mouse and keyboard for everything else. You can change >the button layout to whatever you want in games that are designed to >be played with a gamepad.
No doubt there is value in having a special controller for each game, but having too many is a downside for me. Even though I know I would enjoy racing more with a wheel, I refuse to buy one, just too much shit to plug in and hook up. I already feel that pain now when I have to slap the Streetfighter stick on the desk to play SFIV.
It's a little hard to explain what I mean about the 360 controller (with certain games) until you try it and compare to the other controllers side by side. I didn't understand either when I used to use my other gamepads well enough.
> ...The answer is to get a 360 controller for the PC...
I'm a mature gamer who never got into consoles...so I hate gamepad type controllers. This is one reason, I guess, why I tend to struggle with cross-platform games that appear on the PC. This batman game looks like one of the better "conversions".
On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 10:50:00 +0100, "Musicrab" <music...@hotmail.co.uk> wrote:
>> ...The answer is to get a 360 controller for the PC...
>I'm a mature gamer who never got into consoles...so I hate gamepad type >controllers. This is one reason, I guess, why I tend to struggle with >cross-platform games that appear on the PC. This batman game looks like one >of the better "conversions".
Kory <k0...@none.com> writes: > I finally ended up getting a 360 controller to play GTA IV. The 360 > was a must-have there, because of the index-finger throttle controls > which my existing game pad only had buttons for (always fully on or > off doesn't make for a very realistic car throttle and makes it harder > to control). I started seeing what I had been missing in other games.
I find that odd. I played GTA4 with on the 360 first and always wondered why they wasted the analog triggers. Throttle response is so slow that it doesn't matter at all whether you have analog triggers digital buttons for throttle.
Therefore, I have absolutely no problem playing GTA4 on the PC with my old Saitek P2500 which has only digital buttons. And no tweaking required. Well, except for controlling the helicopter, rudder doesn't work at all although everything else does, go figure. Don't really need rudder to steer the heli though.
On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 14:23:33 +0300, Anssi Saari <a...@sci.fi> wrote: >Kory <k0...@none.com> writes:
>> I finally ended up getting a 360 controller to play GTA IV. The 360 >> was a must-have there, because of the index-finger throttle controls >> which my existing game pad only had buttons for (always fully on or >> off doesn't make for a very realistic car throttle and makes it harder >> to control). I started seeing what I had been missing in other games.
>I find that odd. I played GTA4 with on the 360 first and always >wondered why they wasted the analog triggers. Throttle response is so >slow that it doesn't matter at all whether you have analog triggers >digital buttons for throttle.
>Therefore, I have absolutely no problem playing GTA4 on the PC with my >old Saitek P2500 which has only digital buttons.
Maybe it comes down to a matter of preference. To me, in any game that involves driving as one aspect of movement (as opposed to a racing game where youre driving the whole time) benefits from analog throttle. The alternative involves either running the car wide open (you're gonna crash and burn a lot in GTAIV if you do that), or simply pumping the button (or key) to achieve a steady speed. That's what I did in the previous GTA games, which I played only with mouse and keyboard, and it can be done... but its not as much fun as the analog triggers. I really cant comment on how the xbox version of the game feels regarding throttle. In the PC if you pull the trigger all the way in, its the same as if you just held a digital button down.
I am just going to speak my mind on this subject and let it rest, because a year ago if any of you told me how much more I would enjoy some of these multi-platform games if I had a 360 controller, I wouldn't have "got it" either. It's something I realized only after I started using it. I used to play GRID with my Logitech Dual Action, using the right analog stick for throttle... it will work well enough if you get used to it, but its infinitely better with the 360 controller. Also the 360 controller quality feels orders of magnitude better than any of the Logitech / Gravis stuff I've had.. I still prefer Logitech mice to Microsofts.
One of these days I am going to load Assassins Creed back up (I bought it before I had the 360 controller and didn't care for playing it with mouse and keyboard), just to see if I can get into it more playing it as it was meant to be played.
>On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 18:07:39 -0400, Kory <k0...@none.com> wrote:
>>No doubt there is value in having a special controller for each game, >>but having too many is a downside for me. Even though I know I would >>enjoy racing more with a wheel, I refuse to buy one, just too much >>shit to plug in and hook up. I already feel that pain now when I have >>to slap the Streetfighter stick on the desk to play SFIV.
>>It's a little hard to explain what I mean about the 360 controller >>(with certain games) until you try it and compare to the other >>controllers side by side. I didn't understand either when I used to >>use my other gamepads well enough.
>I can't enjoy racing games without a wheel and pedals. It is just so >much more fun and realistic with the wheel and pedals. That's why I >never buy racing games for my PS3. I'm not buying controllers for both >PC and PS3 as that is too costly.
>It only takes me about 30 seconds to hook up my wheel and pedals. It >is always plugged into power and just needs me to hook up to USB to >use. Wheel and pedals sit underneath my desk so always in close reach. >When I first started racing on the PC I used a CH joystick and was >actualy OK with it but once I went to wheel and pedals there was no >going back. I highly recomend you get one.
If I were heavily into racing games, I wouldn't hesitate.. No doubt that's the right way to play them. My set up is very different than most people. I do work with robotics on my primary PC, so I've got all kinds of shit hooked up to mine that most people would not. Having to unplug and plug in one more thing is not worth the trouble for me. Games like GRID play well enough with the 360 controller and thats about as far into the racing genre as I care to go.
>On Sat, 29 Aug 2009 18:07:39 -0400, Kory <k0...@none.com> wrote:
>>It's a little hard to explain what I mean about the 360 controller >>(with certain games) until you try it and compare to the other >>controllers side by side. I didn't understand either when I used to >>use my other gamepads well enough.
>Didn't comment on this before, srry.
>I used to have 360 and did use 360 gamepad on the PC. It's the best >gamepad out there but I traded my 360 to a freind for his PS3 because >I wanted the BluRay so no more 360 gamepad. I should maybe buy one for >just the PC becuase it is a good. Problem is that some older games >don't recognize it. Ever time I loaded up WininEleven8 the game would >lock up and it was caused by the 360 gamepad for some reason. Weird.
Yeah the qualities that I'm describing in the 360 controller really only apply to new games (last 2-3 years) that are labelled "Games for Windows"... those are the ones that seem to be "perfectly laid out" and calibrated for the controller out of the box, just plug and go.
Good to have a dual action or something near by if you play older games with the gamepad.. I just never did much so I gave my dual action away.
On Mon, 31 Aug 2009 21:05:57 -0700, Beezer <use...@SPAMTRAP.net> wrote:
>On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 15:35:42 -0400, Kory <k0...@none.com> wrote:
>>Games like GRID play well enough with the 360 controller and thats >>about as far into the racing genre as I care to go.
>OK, Grid is a different kind of racing game compared to the likes of >rFactor and GTR2. In those games a gamepad would mnake for a very >frustrating drive because you would just crash way too much in them. >Grid is more forgiving.
Yep, understood, GRID is a driving game and not a racing sim, wasn't suggesting a 360 pad would be good for those, only that it's good for any game that is multiplatform... meaning if its a driving or flying game you see on the xbox or ps3, it will work better with the 360 controller on the PC than anything else.
Michael Cecil <mace...@gmail.com> writes: > On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 10:50:00 +0100, "Musicrab" <music...@hotmail.co.uk> > wrote:
> >> ...The answer is to get a 360 controller for the PC...
> >I'm a mature gamer who never got into consoles...so I hate gamepad type > >controllers. This is one reason, I guess, why I tend to struggle with > >cross-platform games that appear on the PC. This batman game looks like one > >of the better "conversions".
>> On Sun, 30 Aug 2009 10:50:00 +0100, "Musicrab" <music...@hotmail.co.uk> >> wrote:
>> >> ...The answer is to get a 360 controller for the PC...
>> >I'm a mature gamer who never got into consoles...so I hate gamepad type >> >controllers. This is one reason, I guess, why I tend to struggle with >> >cross-platform games that appear on the PC. This batman game looks like one >> >of the better "conversions".
Musicrab wrote: > Just tried the demo of this on PC and, while 3rd person action games aren't > my favourite, this looks like a rare bit of action quality on PC.
This. Game. Is. Awesome.
Last Friday I was shopping for movie DVDs and picked up three games: Batman AA, Red Faction: Guerrilla, and Resident Evil 5. I installed all three and played the first 15 to 20 minutes of each.
Then I focussed on playing Batman.
I'm sure Red Faction gets better but so far ... I seem to be a terrifying ... building demolition specialist. How exciting. My first experience with Resident Evil is from standing in the arcade with the plastic guns. This 5th version seems pretty good and the partner is hot. Meow.
But Batman ... I played for several hours over the weekend and couldn't stop. The fighting is very good but the stealthy take-downs (inverted is my favourite) and detectiving and gadgetry is great. You have to think to solve the challenges and it hasn't been repetitive at all.
The graphics and sounds are unbelievable. The experience is immersive. As a fan of the comics from childhood, I am a very satisfied customer. This is the dark knight.
> Musicrab wrote: >> Just tried the demo of this on PC and, while 3rd person action games >> aren't my favourite, this looks like a rare bit of action quality on PC.
> This. Game. Is. Awesome.
> Last Friday I was shopping for movie DVDs and picked up three games: > Batman AA, Red Faction: Guerrilla, and Resident Evil 5. I installed all > three and played the first 15 to 20 minutes of each.
> Then I focussed on playing Batman.
> I'm sure Red Faction gets better but so far ... I seem to be a terrifying > ... building demolition specialist. How exciting. My first experience with > Resident Evil is from standing in the arcade with the plastic guns. This > 5th version seems pretty good and the partner is hot. Meow.
> But Batman ... I played for several hours over the weekend and couldn't > stop. The fighting is very good but the stealthy take-downs (inverted is > my favourite) and detectiving and gadgetry is great. You have to think to > solve the challenges and it hasn't been repetitive at all.
> The graphics and sounds are unbelievable. The experience is immersive. As > a fan of the comics from childhood, I am a very satisfied customer. This > is the dark knight.
> - Sheldon
I very rarely get impressed by games these days and less so by the demos - but this demo has me extremely interested. Its got to be the slickest demo I have ever played and I am planning to get the game very soon becuase of it. Having seen so many rubbish shooters and RTS games come out this year to finish it off with a great game like this, plus having bought the superb Fallout 3 not so long ago, and recently the one and only great ARMA2, both of which were great games I am very glad to say I have almost got over completely the whole bloody awful Empire Total War charade that made my so depressed with PC gaming lately. Im just so pleased with myself I didnt waste by money on Modern Warfare 2 instead!! Perhaps Empire TW at least taught my to try before I buy and to wait for the reviews. Batman here I come - now I will just have to buy the recent films as well.
> I very rarely get impressed by games these days and less so by the demos > - but this demo has me extremely interested. Its got to be the slickest > demo I have ever played and I am planning to get the game very soon > becuase of it. Having seen so many rubbish shooters and RTS games come > out this year to finish it off with a great game like this, plus having > bought the superb Fallout 3 not so long ago, and recently the one and > only great ARMA2, both of which were great games I am very glad to say I > have almost got over completely the whole bloody awful Empire Total War > charade that made my so depressed with PC gaming lately. Im just so > pleased with myself I didnt waste by money on Modern Warfare 2 instead!! > Perhaps Empire TW at least taught my to try before I buy and to wait for > the reviews. Batman here I come - now I will just have to buy the recent > films as well.
It is definitely in the style of the two most recent movies.
I am glad I bought this game and it is lots of fun to play ... except for the perspective-crippled boss battles.
The good parts (90% of the game) are so good they are like pure sugar. The bad parts (10%) are so bad they are like poo. Why they would want to toss poo in with the sugar is beyond me.
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