I am still new to Lisp, nevertheless I can't wait until I am more experienced, to try CLIM, which seems to have a very powerful UI concept.
Is there an easy way to install McCLIM in either SBCL or CMUCL on Unix or OpenMCL on MacOSX? I don't dare (and understand) the SBCL installation which is described on the CLiki page (http://www.cliki.net/McCLIM), but I hope, things might have gotten simpler meanwhile...
> Is there an easy way to install McCLIM in either SBCL or CMUCL on Unix or > OpenMCL on MacOSX? I don't dare (and understand) the SBCL installation > which is described on the CLiki page (http://www.cliki.net/McCLIM), but I > hope, things might have gotten simpler meanwhile...
I first had a crack at installing McCLIM a couple of weeks ago and found it pretty simple (both with SBCL and CMUCL on my GNU/Linux box). I pulled the latest sources from CVS and then followed the instructions in INSTALL.SBCL and INSTALL.CMU.
Step 2 in INSTALL.SBCL was made somewhat easier thanks to asdf-install (install that if you don't already have it). IIRC all I had to do to get CLX working with SBCL was:
Once I'd got McCLIM built I simply symlinked ~/.sbcl/systems/clim.asd to /usr/local/src/McCLIM/system.lisp and then loading McCLIM, in SBCL, is simply a case of doing:
,---- | (require :clim) `----
Same with CMUCL, although CMUCL doesn't have SBCL's handy require back.
> I am still new to Lisp, nevertheless I can't wait until I am more > experienced, to try CLIM, which seems to have a very powerful UI concept.
> Is there an easy way to install McCLIM in either SBCL or CMUCL on Unix > or OpenMCL on MacOSX? I don't dare (and understand) the SBCL > installation which is described on the CLiki page > (http://www.cliki.net/McCLIM), but I hope, things might have gotten > simpler meanwhile...
If you get the binary release of SBCL from SourceForge, the install is very simple; you can just unpack the package and run the install script.
Then download and unpack McCLIM and follow its install instructions and things should work, more or less.
You'll need Apple's X11 to run it, at least until the lengthy porting effort produces an Aqua version of McCLIM that is reasonably useable.
Installing with OpenMCL is pretty much the same, and there's a set of OpenMCL-specific install instructions with McCLIM. It assumes you are going to use defsystem, but I have made it work by inferring the correct changes for use with ASDF.
> I am still new to Lisp, nevertheless I can't wait until I am more > experienced, to try CLIM, which seems to have a very powerful UI concept.
> Is there an easy way to install McCLIM in either SBCL or CMUCL on Unix > or OpenMCL on MacOSX? I don't dare (and understand) the SBCL > installation which is described on the CLiki page > (http://www.cliki.net/McCLIM), but I hope, things might have gotten > simpler meanwhile...
> Thanks, > Chris
The McCLIM distribution comes with installation instructions. Did you see/read them? I was able to use McCLIM with OpenMCL on Mac OS X.
Dave Pearson wrote: > Step 2 in INSTALL.SBCL was made somewhat easier thanks to asdf-install > (install that if you don't already have it). IIRC all I had to do to get CLX > working with SBCL was:
> Once I'd got McCLIM built I simply symlinked ~/.sbcl/systems/clim.asd to > /usr/local/src/McCLIM/system.lisp and then loading McCLIM, in SBCL, is > simply a case of doing:
I did this, but I could not find it in the INSTALL instructions.
But: Either CLIM is supposed to be as unstable as it is, or something went wrong. E.g. when I open a menu in the address book demo, the whole X server hangs (although the menu demo works). The calculator won't start at all, and the function make-application-frame is undefined. Is that supposed to be like that?
> > Once I'd got McCLIM built I simply symlinked ~/.sbcl/systems/clim.asd to > > /usr/local/src/McCLIM/system.lisp and then loading McCLIM, in SBCL, is > > simply a case of doing:
> I did this, but I could not find it in the INSTALL instructions.
Indeed it isn't; I think I picked up the hint from a page on Cliki.
> > ,---- > > | (require :clim) > > `----
> for me: > (require :asdf-install)
I wouldn't have thought that you'd need that after your initial install.
> (require :clx) > (require :clim)
I'm fairly sure that, for me anyway, doing the require for :clim causes :clx to be loaded, but I might be mistaken (I would test it now but I've got newer sources of McCLIM kicking around from the last time I ran it all up with SBCL and it'll take a while to do a rebuild on my aging machine).
> (require :clim-clx)
Sorry, yes, I forgot to mention this one (in my defence I generally use CMUCL for mucking about with CLIM).
> (require :clim-examples)
Yes, you'll need to do that for the examples.
> Either CLIM is supposed to be as unstable as it is, or something went > wrong. E.g. when I open a menu in the address book demo, the whole X > server hangs (although the menu demo works). The calculator won't start at > all, and the function make-application-frame is undefined. Is that > supposed to be like that?
My apologies, I should have mentioned my experience with this. I too have this problem with SBCL and McCLIM (and, if I ever get round to testing it properly I do intend to file some sort of report about it). On the other hand I've found that McCLIM works well with CMUCL, the menu problem doesn't appear. On my box I've got this:
Dave Pearson wrote: > * Christian Hofer <ch_s...@gmx.de>: >>for me: >>(require :asdf-install)
> I wouldn't have thought that you'd need that after your initial install.
You are right, I don't. (But I do need (require :asdf).)
>>(require :clx) >>(require :clim)
> I'm fairly sure that, for me anyway, doing the require for :clim causes :clx > to be loaded, but I might be mistaken
No, I'm sorry, you are right. I was sure, that last time it didn't work. But now it works perfectly. Only it takes quite some time. It seems to recompile s.th.
>>Either CLIM is supposed to be as unstable as it is, or something went >>wrong. E.g. when I open a menu in the address book demo, the whole X >>server hangs (although the menu demo works). The calculator won't start at >>all, and the function make-application-frame is undefined. Is that >>supposed to be like that?
> My apologies, I should have mentioned my experience with this. I too have > this problem with SBCL and McCLIM (and, if I ever get round to testing it > properly I do intend to file some sort of report about it). On the other > hand I've found that McCLIM works well with CMUCL, the menu problem doesn't > appear. On my box I've got this:
I just wanted to know that it's not me doing s.th. wrong. I could not expect to get a stable release by downloading a nightly build. I will try it with CMUCL. Does anybody know, if the released version is working better (being a alpha release anyway)?
> as a way of kicking it all off. As you'll note, for speed and ease of use, I > make a point of dumping a core with CLX and McCLIM loaded.
Until now, I thought dumping core is what my C programs tend to do all by themselves ;-) Ok, i'll have a look how that works (is it s.th. like the Smalltalk "image"?)
Christian Hofer <ch_s...@gmx.de> writes: > Dave Pearson wrote: [...] >> Once I'd got McCLIM built I simply symlinked >> ~/.sbcl/systems/clim.asd to >> /usr/local/src/McCLIM/system.lisp and then loading McCLIM, in SBCL, is >> simply a case of doing:
> I did this, but I could not find it in the INSTALL instructions.
This is an ASDF feature, not a McCLIM one.
> Either CLIM is supposed to be as unstable as it is, or something went
McCLIM is currently Alpha-ish quality.
> wrong. E.g. when I open a menu in the address book demo, the whole X > server hangs (although the menu demo works). The calculator won't > start at all, and the function make-application-frame is undefined. Is > that supposed to be like that?
The first symptom reminds me of a problem fixed in the latest CVS sources. Which sources did you try?
Paolo -- Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film Recommended Common Lisp libraries/tools (Google for info on each): - ASDF/ASDF-INSTALL: system building/installation - CL-PPCRE: regular expressions - UFFI: Foreign Function Interface
Christian Hofer <ch_s...@gmx.de> writes: > by themselves ;-) Ok, i'll have a look how that works (is it > s.th. like the Smalltalk "image"?)
Yes. See functions EXT:SAVE-LISP (CMUCL) and SB-EXT:SAVE-LISP-AND-DIE (SBCL).
Paolo -- Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film Recommended Common Lisp libraries/tools (Google for info on each): - ASDF/ASDF-INSTALL: system building/installation - CL-PPCRE: regular expressions - UFFI: Foreign Function Interface
Christian Hofer <ch_s...@gmx.de> writes: > I just wanted to know that it's not me doing s.th. wrong. I could not > expect to get a stable release by downloading a nightly build. I will > try it with CMUCL. Does anybody know, if the released version is > working better (being a alpha release anyway)?
I seem to remember that the menu problem you mentioned has already been reported. I do not experience it with the latest McCLIM CVS sources and CMUCL 18e/SBCL 0.8.10.14 under Debian Woody.
McCLIM is currently Alpha quality, but it is already useful. A summary of its compatibility status with the CLIM 2.0 specification is available at:
Paolo -- Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film Recommended Common Lisp libraries/tools (Google for info on each): - ASDF/ASDF-INSTALL: system building/installation - CL-PPCRE: regular expressions - UFFI: Foreign Function Interface
Paolo -- Why Lisp? http://alu.cliki.net/RtL%20Highlight%20Film Recommended Common Lisp libraries/tools (Google for info on each): - ASDF/ASDF-INSTALL: system building/installation - CL-PPCRE: regular expressions - UFFI: Foreign Function Interface
Paolo Amoroso wrote: > Christian Hofer <ch_s...@gmx.de> writes: >>wrong. E.g. when I open a menu in the address book demo, the whole X >>server hangs (although the menu demo works). The calculator won't >>start at all, and the function make-application-frame is undefined. Is >>that supposed to be like that?
> The first symptom reminds me of a problem fixed in the latest CVS > sources. Which sources did you try?
The "nightly build". Maybe it is not so nightly after all? Or maybe, it's because my FreeBSD currently has some X library portupgrade problems... I'll try with CMUCL (or OpenMCL on my iBook - it is nice to have so much choice...)
> > I wouldn't have thought that you'd need that after your initial install.
> You are right, I don't. (But I do need (require :asdf).)
If it's something you use a lot it might be a good idea to load asdf in your ~/.sbclrc.
> > My apologies, I should have mentioned my experience with this. I too > > have this problem with SBCL and McCLIM (and, if I ever get round to > > testing it properly I do intend to file some sort of report about it). > > On the other hand I've found that McCLIM works well with CMUCL, the menu > > problem doesn't appear. On my box I've got this:
> I just wanted to know that it's not me doing s.th. wrong. I could not > expect to get a stable release by downloading a nightly build. I will try > it with CMUCL. Does anybody know, if the released version is working > better (being a alpha release anyway)?
I updated from CVS a couple of hours ago and rebuilt with SBCL and the problem still seems to be there. I've not tested the latest code with CMUCL yet but I'd suspect that it's still fine.
> > as a way of kicking it all off. As you'll note, for speed and ease of > > use, I make a point of dumping a core with CLX and McCLIM loaded.
> Until now, I thought dumping core is what my C programs tend to do all by > themselves ;-) Ok, i'll have a look how that works (is it s.th. like the > Smalltalk "image"?)
Can't comment on the Smalltalk thing but saving a new core file is easy enough with CMUCL; the function to use is even given and an example shown at the end of INSTALL.CMU in the McCLIM sources.
Dave Pearson wrote: > * Christian Hofer <ch_s...@gmx.de>: >>You are right, I don't. (But I do need (require :asdf).)
> If it's something you use a lot it might be a good idea to load asdf in your > ~/.sbclrc.
Good idea! Until now, I have mainly written small programs for learning purposes.
> Can't comment on the Smalltalk thing but saving a new core file is easy > enough with CMUCL; the function to use is even given and an example shown at > the end of INSTALL.CMU in the McCLIM sources.
Thanks. I have just managed to run McCLIM on a CMUCL core file. It is really a lot more stable. But the first look at CLIM is a bit confusing. I will have to experiment a lot more with it, when I find time for it.
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