I have a 15 year old Giant Yukon MTB and a Trek Road flat bar racer. I
like the stance of a MTB and I am principally a commuter so when the MTB
seemed too old (and there was coin in my pocket) the flat bar racer
seemed a sensible move. Trek bike is 2 years old. They have a similar
frame size and are both in excellent condition. (I think...)

Question is this.

I can ride the MTB endlessly and feel fine when I get off it. These days
  when I ride the Trek I end up with almost crippling back pain.

Do I consult my friendly bike shop guy? See a medico? I'm not sure
whether the skinny wheels and structure of the flat bar racer mean more
road vibration ends up in my back whereas,  the MTB has reasonably fat
tyres which seem to soak more of the vibrations up. (The MTB has no
suspension)

Any thoughts?

Cheers

In addition, I would also compare the distance from the saddle to the
handlebar grips to see whether that is causing you to reach further.

I assume 'crippling back pain' is muscular and goes away after a short
time off the bike and not sciatic/ pinched nerve pain that drops you to
the floor (speaking from experience).

regards,
20cents

Probably the road bike set up is wrong. Too long and maybe bars too low.

For length, use your forearm (fingers straight) as a measure. From seat to
bars, there should be 1.5 to 2 inches to the bars, measured horizontally.
May need a shorter or longer stem, or move the seat forward or back.
[There are a few theories about seat fore-aft position. The easiest is that
the patella should be over the pedal axle when the cranks are horizontal].

For height:

1. Seat height with your heel on the pedal, your leg is straight. Sometimes
people ride too high and the pelvis rocks up and down with each stroke.
This may be your back pain.

2. Start with the bars at max height (the stem's marker for max), and ride
this for a (long) while. You should report no pain. Lower 10 mm and ride
again for a (long) while. Repeat till you find the best feel. After three months
try 10 and 20 mm lower.

Getting this right depends on arm length, torso length, and what you can
get used to.

Other option: do some yoga or other back exercise. If you need reading
glasses, check that you haven't caused back strain using a computer
with a very fixed (and slightly strained) posture.

T.

VEry comfortable and plush indeed.

If comfort is what you are after, go 'bent!

http://www.bacchettablog.com/news/joe-kratovil-loving-cycling-again

"The adaptation process from riding uprights to recumbents was not
easy for me.  I struggled at first but gradually kept improving.  I
worked my way through the Randonneur events one at a time.  I managed
to complete my fourth full series finishing the 600k just this past
weekend.  I feel much more comfortable on the bike and have actually
come to enjoy the advantages of recumbent riding.  I continue to ride
with the same group of friends as I always have.  They were very
accepting of the new bike and have been very patient during the
changeover process.  Although there are some trade-offs involved, the
recumbent is undeniably more comfortable to ride than anything else
I've ever had.  My body has healed from the years of abuse I
heaped on it riding stiff bikes with even stiffer saddles.  I love
cycling again.  It's almost all I think about."

Well.. you didn't think I'd keep quiet on this thread did you?

Zebee

Can someone remind me what a LBS is? Mr Woof (:D) said this:

"Find a LBS that does fittings and pay for one. Fair bet your back ache
will be a thing of the past."

Thanks all, much to ponder

You need to carefully check seat height and the seat slope, and try to
find the difference between when you are sitting on one bike and when on
the other. I have 3 bikes and don't find any one of them causes me any
backache, and that's because the riding position is the same for all 3.

I have tried many remedies for backache.

I generally found doctors, chiro practors and physiotherapists quite
useless, although Voltaren slow release worked well when I was 35 some
27 yrs ago. Now I get terrible mouth ulcers with many anti-inflamatory
drugs, including pain killers like Panadol and Panadienne.

When young, I would sometimes find a thouroughly good big root did the
trick. Or else it made matters worse, leaving the shiela browned off
because she couldn't have sex. A couple of wanks lying on flat carpeted
floors worked better.

Now I am older, I realise why sex of some sort helped. It involved lying
down and being relaxed for some of the time and then using movement of
the vertebrae to "prove a point". Any vertebrae which may be slightly
out of place then tended to slip back into place.
I often will do some damn thing that "puts me back out" such as using an
axe to chop a branch, pick up an awkward heavy load, or some how upset
the discs in my spine which is showing its age at 62.
Sometimes I do something and I feel nothing until days later, and then I
am bent sideways and in pain.
So its onto the floor I get, and I lie there for awhile on my back
thinking about angels in heaven and then I look one way and lean both
legs over in the opposite direction, thus twisting the spine gently
without the weight of thr body compressing it.
There will often be a "click" and maybe a "clunk" when I turn te other
way. Its the slightly displaced discs slipping back into their natural
central position. Doing the same thing in a hot bath also works well.

I also know one fabulous accupuncturist. His name is Douglas Godfrey and
his practice is in O'Connor, ACT. I have been several if not many times
to him with crook backs and crook necks, and aches and pains from too
much typing or doing tricky activities.
His use of the laser pointer has worked miracles. One time I was so bad
that i could barely walk, barely sleep, and nothing seemed to work.
This was the legacy of helping a friend move house a week before. The
physiotherpaist made things worse, the doctor had me get an MRI scan,
and pills were useless. But after ONE treatment with my acupuncturist
there was no pain a day later and I was able to resume work and carry
anything heavy.

When aged in my early 40s I raced on bikes and worked as a builder, and
I had a sex hungry girlfriend. I burnt the candle at both ends and in
the middle. I often did time trials where there was a need to raise the
seat and lower the handlebars to get the back flat to reduce wind drag.
I found there was a critical limit, and just another 5mm bar drop caused
me no end of pains for a week.

The other thing that kept me racing and working and rooting was Yoga. I
went to some classes where Hatha Yoga was taught by a very fine young
shiela who really knew how to keep well. I found the stretching of the
muscles behind and in front of the legs was critical to having a nice
pain free and supple back. I don't build now, so I ain't abusing myself
by doing too many physicals. So I don't seem to need to do any Yoga
which promotes the body's inner healing mechanisms. But stretching stil
works well. In summer I swim maybe 1.5km a week, and this has the effect
of gently twisting the spine and rippling it to ease the discs back into
place. My pool is too cold right now but I will be very glad to swim
again beginning in September. So preventative measures like swimming and
yoga DO WORK. I am now riding 200km a week average. I've cycled the
equivalent of going around Oz a couple of times in the last 3 years. If
I can, maybe you can.

Patrick Turner.

And those of us following have trouble keeping up.

All my bikes are steel framed with 23mm tyres. The 753R is the most
comfy, and least tiring, and I have often done over 100km with few aches
apart from exhaustion from keeping up with younger riders. One day that
753R will crack apart and maybe I will get a carbon fibre frame.
I hear that carbon is nicer to ride on than steel, and people all tell
me steel is very good, along with titanium, followed by aluminium which
is a hard dead ride.

The secret to being comfy on the bike is to ride with slight bend in the
arms and spread the weight between arms and arse. The saddle should be
comfy. Some are better than others, and angles and heights of saddles
are critical. You should feel naturally at ease with the bike.
It should feel like a fine coordinated dance on pedals. You should get
out of the saddle now and then even when on a flat road to aid arse
circulaton and to change body position and use different muscles.

There is no point in trying to make yourself adopt the full race flat
back race position of better cyclists than yourself. You should only
ever addopt what feels right for you, and if that means 2% more wind
drag and 5% less speed, then so be it, accept it, or else suffer.

Patrick Turner.

--
--
Pete.B

Flying Furniture in Canberra gave me a long test ride, it is
possible Trisled in Melb might do the same.

I also contacted ozhpv.org and asked on their mailing list if any of
their members would be willing to let me try a 'bent and got several
offers.

THat latter's probably your best bet, most 'bent riders are
eveangelical.

Do note that 'bents come in a very wide range of types.  High and low,
long wheelbase, short wheelbase, set up like racers, set up like
tourers.  They feel different from each other and ride differently.

Zebee